My machinist said about the same thing .... and said stay far away from Probe !

 

Eagle and SCAT do NOT get their cranks, rods or anything else from the same source. They buy the materials from different stock. Just because they both come from China, doesn't mean they come from the same forgings, or have the same QC systems in their individual factories.

Visit Eagle sometime. You'll do a 180*, seriously. The shop just south of Memphis is absolutely amazing. They've got a $3 mil polishing machine in there.

 

They've got a $3 mil polishing machine in there.

Cool but who is operating it, trade school student or seasoned professional?

I've heard Scat is sligthly better than Eagle but my forged Eagle kit was real nice and guy balancing said it took very little to balance it. Professional polished mine by the way.

 

I used the Scat 9000 series crank for my 408w. It only needed 39 grams of heavy metal in the front of the crank to complete the balance. Had to remove a little weight from the center and rear. The part that gave my machinist the most problem was the high dollar JW Ultra Wheel. It was 200 grams out. He had to mill half of the counter weight off to get it to come in.

I had trouble getting my rods from Scat, and I called Flatlander Racing to see if they had any in stock. They told me that Scat, Eagle and Proform all recieved there forgings from the same company. Go figure.

Give Brian Adams a call. He deals in the Scat and Eagle stuff. Maybe he can shed some light on the truth.

 

Eagle and SCAT do NOT get their cranks, rods or anything else from the same source.

If this is true and the machinist above doesn't even have the basic facts straight on the matter, I wouldn't put much stock in his comments. Funny thing is, I've heard the exact opposite from most engine guys, that Eagle has poor QC and they need to be checked carefully. Both brands are plenty strong from what I've seen, and also wouldn't hesitate to use the cast stuff in an average build. Depends on application though.

 

My machinest commented on the same thing. He really didn't say anything bad about Scat, but I think he's more familiar with Eagle. I dunno, but the Eagle Kit he had in mind for me was just overkill for the level I'm at. He was surprised when I showed up with the Scat Kit. As Billy said, there are so many different opinions. I few of my friends recommended Scat. I did a lot of research here on Corral and so far I think the Scat Kit will work well for me.

 

I've heard pretty decent things about Scat and Eagle cast kits. I think I'd rather go with Scat, but only if they're at the same price. I don't think I'm going to use that shop, not because he doesn't know where Eagle and Scat get thier castings, but because I'm afraid he might not take a cast build as seriously.

I still think that if the HP and RPM ratings of the Scat stuff is anywhere near accurate, I should be ok with it. I'm looking at only a mild 347, no nitrous, no revs beyond 6500. I am looking to build torquier for the street, I'm tired of having to rev my engine to get some power out of it.

 

My friend built a 408w with Eagle parts. The car made it to the 60 foot mark, first time out, and the motor grenaded itself. The mallory fell out of the crankshaft and destroyed everything, including the block.

 

My friend had a 408 with a Scat 9000 cast crank in a late model 84 351 block. He had it zero balanced and it didn't take an excessive amount to zero balance it. On the dope, it probably made close to 1000 HP at the crank. He split the block on the nuber two main straight upto the cam bearings. When we took the crank out, what was left of the main, fell into the block. Had the crank magged and it wasn't even cracked. Even the main bearings didn't look too bad.

 

My friend built a 408w with Eagle parts. The car made it to the 60 foot mark, first time out, and the motor grenaded itself. The mallory fell out of the crankshaft and destroyed everything, including the block.

I don't think that event had anything to do with the crank itself but was a problem with the heavy metal install by the engine builder.

I've got the Eagle forged crank and H beam rods and they seem to be doing their job so far.

Billy - Why not just get the forged stuff now so you can pretty much forget about having to replace it later when you add even more HP?

 

Eagle forged guts on my junk and no problems thus far. All machined by Keith Craft. Got about 750 street miles on it and close to 20 passes.

 

So I called my machinist, and here is what he says.

1) That the Eagle and the Scat stuff look very similar and that sometimes they come with the same part numbers in the same places stamped on them.
2) Scat does all the final work on them here for sure.
3) That he is pretty sure that Eagle does not have a facility to finish their cranks here. That when you open the box, the last person to see it was chinese. (Beware of SARs LOL)
4) Never had a Scat problem, but has seen very unusual bearing wear on the Eagle cranks.

He prefers to use Scat stuff.

 

Billy - Why not just get the forged stuff now so you can pretty much forget about having to replace it later when you add even more HP?

Good question, John. Here's what I'm thinking. I'd like to build a mild 347 for now. Drive it around, put some miles on it, use it for a daily driver. I am in grad school and still have ~1.5 years or so left. After that I can get a job and make the big bucks. If at that time I want to go with another car for a daily driver, or even build this car for high HP daily driver use, I can sell the mild 347 and do what I really want to do, which is go to a 351 Dart block, stroke and blow that with AFR 205's or so. No that's big bucks, which I completely don't have right now. That's the same reason I am worrying over $500. I really understand the mentality where overkill is always better because you're not going to stop here, but I am pretty sure my next step will be a big one.


Everyone,

I've noticed KC puts Scat 9000/Ibeam stuff in thier short blocks, and I've never heard of a parts oriented problem with them. I have heard of poor machining, using sleeves and crap like that, but never a problem with the parts. Still thinking...

 

Opinions.

Everyone has one... and most of them stink.

First, Eagle and Scat do NOT share the same facility for forgings or castings.

Yes, forgings are nicer but it's easy to spend OTHER people's money. For a NA 347 that is a 'mild' street/strip car you're going to have a difficult time breaking a cast setup.

John's point is valid that if you're going to upgrade down the road but if you're planning something different there is no point to spending the money.

Finally, no one argues the strength of either product. I've done a BOATLOAD of both and the reason I prefer Scat is that they're quality control is a little bit better, if you have 1000 pieces Eagle has 25 that are defective, Scat has 15. They also have a nicer finish on most of their crankshafts and offer some higher end cranks (lightweighted, ect.)

From a design stand point I also think Scat is definately a step ahead. They've recently redesigned their 351 based forgings that are easily nicer than the Eagle parts (lighter too.) They also are the front runners on new crank designs and offer BBF cranks, Flat heads and other offerings that Eagle has not introduced. To top it off they design and produce bullet proof billet cranks so they have a lot more into R & D than Eagle IMO. That said Eagle doesn't make a bad product, it's just my experience that Scat makes a better product.

Brian

 

Brian,

As always, you've been very helpful. I'm thinking Scat 9000 crank, Scat I beams, and SRP pistons. Thanks,

Billy

 

I'm tired of having to rev my engine to get some power out of it.

Hey Bill..........Drop a Cummings in it then

 

Hey Bill..........Drop a Cummings in it then

Hey, if it didn't weigh so much, I think it would be pretty cool. I could go back to my 2.73 gears and torque on by the LS1's. Now wouldn't you feel like a tool if you got outrun by someone revving only 2500 rpm???

 

I really don't fault the guy for being mislead as to where Scat and Eagle get thier castings and forgings. It's not exactly in thier catalog or anything. Actually it's funny, you can give just about anyone a choice of two options, let's say I go to the average car guy and say I'm thinking about going with either a 4340 Scat crank or a Scat billet crank for my near-stock application. I'll bet most of the time average car guy will tell me I better go ahead and spring for the billet crank. Same with heads. Ask a question about heads on this board, and you'll get a bunch of AFR responses. Granted, they're great heads, but unless it's YOUR budget, you don't even notice they're 30% more than other offerings.

 

amen to that Billy, money doesn't make them faster. knowledge and skill does.

 

I have personally used Scat cast cranks in a 342 and 393. They are excellent pieces. I have seen a cast Scat crank (3.85) hold in excess of 600 crank hp on a dyno thrash and come out without a problem. The Scat cast cranks are very strong and well machined.
If you want to add insurance add an H beam rod.

 

Ok, I'm convinced the Scat 9000 stuff should be plenty adequate for my purpose. Thanks.
Billy

 

Think for a minute how harsh Fords quality control is then think for a moment who makes the FMS cast cranks. Give up?
They are Scat 9000 cranks.

 

Think for a minute how harsh Fords quality control is then think for a moment who makes the FMS cast cranks. Give up?
They are Scat 9000 cranks.

yup

 

I bought my Scat 9000, Scat I beams, and Probe pistons from Brian. They had to take quite a bit off the crank to get the balance to 28 oz...I wish I had known that, neutral was probably closer, but my pistons are also freakishly light (396 grams each w/o wrist pins & locks). So far it revs like a dream and runs strong. All of the machining on the crank checked out VERY WELL. I am very pleased with my Scat parts. FWIW, it's my opinion that Eagle and Scat cranks are stronger than the stock block anyways so why bother with a forged crank, or for that matter H beam rods also?

 

I've got a Scat cast crank in my 393. It's producing in the area of 750hp at the crank and runs like a MOFO! Revs like a dream also. I actually had to get into the ecu tonight and raise my limiter to maybe pull a little more rpm out of it at the track. I made 575rwhp/583rwtq with a slipping non-lockup AOD behind it. I don't regret this crank one bit. Very nice piece if you ask me.