The only reason I will ever convert back to a megasquirt... Is if I ever reach the airflow and load scaling limits of my stock ecm.

IMHO, the stock EEC-IV is more than capable of handing your 347 when paired with a quartehorse.

 

i understand where you're coming from, but the mass air systems seem to always have driveability issues, tuned or not, and I'm not exactly sure how the aftermarket MAF companies "calibrate" mass air for injector size. Like I said, Am I paying for a modified speed density 88 mustang ecm or something thats up to date with new(er) ecm technology? for 850 bucks i would hope the latter, and with quarterhorse you're hacking a 20 year old ecm, paying another 400 for licensing and a wideband so its right around the amount you would be spending for a PNP megasquirt and a wideband.. thank you for the feedback.

 

my mass air system didn't give me driveability issues. I daily drove the car with a QH tune for 2 years.

You just need to avoid bull#### parts, like C&L MAF's and take the time to tune it right.

 

The C&L meter on my old 347 never gave me any issues. Meters are hit and miss, there really is no right or wrong way. Just the way that works sometimes.

 

342 with fac 190 heads, track heat intake, xe276hr cam, 39lb cobra injectors, etc. 5 minutes with the tweecer and ran like a champ. Mid 12s n/a all day with no true tuning and no traction(full weight, full interior, all power and accessories and ac 95 model) . Cobbled together a 4“ straight intake with a 90mm Lmaf yesterday. Drove for 20mins today and dialed it in. Just finally ordered a wb tonight to get it better dialed in on the nitrous.
The factory computers with qh or a tweecer are just fine. I only purchased the tweecer. No additional software. Running caledit and calcon. I had a qh, it was great until the on board battery died 6 months after purchase (purchased late 2012). I think that's fixed now.

 

Since I purchased my house the 347 mustang has taken a back seat, Finally got a decent bump in pay and want to get this car right, I hate the way it is with the factory ecu, With quarterhorse it's piggybacking off of 20+ year old computers, Does Megasquirt have a faster processor with faster correction?

Never used a quarterhorse so I can't give you any comparisons there.

With Megasquirt do You have to buy the ECU and then pay more money for some software licensing agreement?

Absolutely not. You don't have to buy anything from anybody specifically. Megasquirt is entirely open source, both hardware and software. All the information necessary to run it is free. Hardware isn't free of course, but all the components are specified, and you can get them wherever/however you like. There are some vendors that put kits together for you to make life easier, such as DIYAutotune. They also sell already assembled megasquirts, and even plug and play megasquirts for different applications, including mustangs.

or is it 839, relocate your iat, run vacuum for your map, remove the ecu, get a wideband o2 and get to tuning?

You got it. There's a handful of electrical connections to sensors that need to be made. You can wire it yourself directly, make an adapter harness to your factory one, or even buy an adapter harness that will plug right in. Then like you said, it needs a vacuum signal. After that, go to town.

My Car is N/A do you believe it's worth getting a megasquirt? What Pids are available to view? has anyone had map sensor failure and if so is it replaceable seperate to the ECU? Thanks corral!

It's mainly what your'e comfortable with. Both ways can work, I don't know that one is really better than the other necessarily. But, one might be better suited to your needs. I chose megasquirt for my 393 because I wanted the experience assembling the system, learning how to tune a car, and doing it with something that is so similar to the other mainstream standalones that it pretty much directly translates. I've since worked with high dollar F.A.S.T XFI2 systems and they're basically the same.

I haven't had MAP sensor failure, but it is replaceable. The internal one has 4 connections, and if you buy an official B&G board, solders to it at 4 points. A replacement job would take 10 to 15 minutes.

Not sure what you mean by what Pids are available to veiw?

 

Thanks sej. Should I get the pnp or the universal megasquirt? Pids as in baro Hz, or kpa, tps voltage, act, ect, hego voltage, load%, injector duty cycle, Does the megasquirt system have a software disc for your laptop?

 

Thanks sej. Should I get the pnp or the universal megasquirt?

Well it mainly depends on what your needs are. What would you like the system to be able to do? Run the car is obvious. Do you have any other requirements?

Pids as in baro Hz, or kpa, tps voltage, act, ect, hego voltage, load%, injector duty cycle, Does the megasquirt system have a software disc for your laptop?

Oh, yes absolutely. You can get all of the telemetry data that megasquirt knows about, and you can display them in different scales if you like. Baro for example can be in kpa, but you can also see vacuum in in/hg and "boost" in psi (though I prefer just straight kpa). All of the other items you mentioned are there, and more.

The software that I recommend is TunerStudio by EFI Analytics. It is free to download and there are windows, mac, and linux versions. You can "work offline" to poke around the settings and play with gauges so you can see all the different data points that you can show. When you log, everything is logged, not just what's displayed too. Additionally if you have them, you can incorporage GPS and accelerometer data which will then also be included in logs.

 

I asked myself the same questions. I never used the QH, but it has a battery on it & the whole thing gets installed inside the EEC. Do you want to take it apart, just to change the battery? To me, that alone makes it worth no more than $100, including the software.

There are 2 different PnP's.
Read this thread: http://forums.corral.net/forums/megasquirt/1238158-how-diypnp-your-mustang.html

 

If the battery flubs, Moates will fix it.

The new units keep their battery life for years. I am still using a 1.4 from 2009.

I love all these ASSumptions.

 

64bit, my experience is not based on an assumption but rather experience. I purchased mine new in late 2012 from a corral vendor. It failed early 2013 due to dead on board battery. Moates did take care of it very quickly. The problem? My car will not run without a tune. This car is my dd.

 

While I can completely sympathize with your situation... It's still not a crushing blow. The battery going dead SHOULDN'T effect the ability to hold a tune while the car has power. However, the batch of QHs that went out with battery problems were identified and fixed.

I however won't have an issue stemming from not being able to drive the car, because I also have the jaybird and a pile of F3 chips hanging around.

 

So quarterhorse goes inside the EEC in order to have a custom tune, and that custom tune is active while there is a good battery installed? If the battery goes flat your custom tune is not active?

 

Im certainly not saying that the MS is a bad deal. I just cant justify spending the $840 on a PNP system...

Especially when I build my last MS for around $350. As for making it plug-n-play... I still have two or three of these kicking around.

My other issue is that the MS still does not have any kind of transmission control. Now I realize that this is less than an issue if you have a manual trans. I have a 4R70W swapped into my car. It still has an automatic valve body, and will stay that way until some time next year, funds willing. So, $840 MS + $650 Baumann TCS... or a hacked up wiring harness allowing me to keep my W4H0 in the loop for trans control, simply cant be justified. My $250 quarterhorse is plenty well capable of handling running my 6800 rpm 347.

 

Im certainly not saying that the MS is a bad deal. I just cant justify spending the $840 on a PNP system...

Especially when I build my last MS for around $350. As for making it plug-n-play... I still have two or three of these kicking around.

Sure the price doesn't make sense for guys like us. We can build one, and we'd rather build one and put our money somewhere else.

For other people it's stepping in to a world they don't know, and they're not willing to let $10k engine be a guiney pig for their learning curve. As a risk offset, and the opportunity cost of their time, the $500 makes sense.

That's the best part about megasquirt and what the vendors have done for it IMO. There's a version (feature-set) and a pricepoint for everybody. Some people can't justify the $350 you spent, when they can do it for less using their own case and breadboard.

That's why I ask what the person's requirements are.

w
My other issue is that the MS still does not have any kind of transmission control. Now I realize that this is less than an issue if you have a manual trans. I have a 4R70W swapped into my car. It still has an automatic valve body, and will stay that way until some time next year, funds willing. So, $840 MS + $650 Baumann TCS... or a hacked up wiring harness allowing me to keep my W4H0 in the loop for trans control, simply cant be justified. My $250 quarterhorse is plenty well capable of handling running my 6800 rpm 347.

There's megashift which I believe communicates with megasquirt over CANbus. You configure it with Tunerstudio so it should be a single pane of glass experience from a tuning perspective. It's the GPIO board with the megashift kit and will you $260ish from DIY.

MegaShift/GPIO Transmission Controller

 

My only problem with sticking with the stock ecu and quarterhorse is dealing with mafs and $100 software licence for BE that is for only one computer. My pro-m maf just took a crap so now I am thinking should I get a $300 maf or a diy megasquirt 2.

 

Maybe I wasn't clear. He specifically said in #16: "...I just cant justify spending the $840 on a PNP system..."

Compare this one at $839: MegaSquirtPNP G2 EEC4A8 for 86-93 Ford Mustang 5.0 DIYAutoTune.com

To this one at $440: DIYPNP Ford 60 pin EEC-IV Unassembled Kit DIYAutoTune.com

But you're right about the rest.

 

No you were perfectly clear, it's just that the subject can be greek to some of the newer folks that come along here (and new folks pop up all the time ) so I justed wanted to clarify for anybody who was green to the subject and may have inadvertently misunderstood your statement.

I guess there's a difference between clear, and layman's terms is what I mean.

 

I am still trying to decide if I should stick with moates QH or make the move to megasquirt. A new pro m maf is about 300 or get the diypnp for 440. I am just worried if I get the megasquirt I won't be able to cruise the car for a month.

 

If you're in a hurry & don't want downtime, that's a different matter. I haven't cruised mine in over a year. I'm tired of throwing bandaids on it that don't work. You'll have to make your own decisions.

Personally, I never like the Pro-M concept. Any changes, it's got to go back to them because of the custom sensor. Why do you need a new MAF?

 

My buddy has a DIYPNP on his procharged 408w mybe I will mess around with his car then make my decision. I think the concept of playing with a VE table instead of a maf transfer is easier. Its ridiculous to have to deal with maf transfer, injector slopes, and Fn1360 table to get fuel straightened out.

 

The DIY, do you have to solder and assemble? thats a costly mistake if youre bad with a soldering pen

 

More details over here: http://forums.corral.net/forums/megasquirt/1238158-how-diypnp-your-mustang.html

If you don't want to do any soldering at all, look here: http://forums.corral.net/forums/meg...ums/megasquirt/1379606-new-megasquirtpnp-86-93-5-0-mustangs-1-hour-install.html

 

There is soldering involved but not as much as a "full board" kit.

 

I Hope i am not the Odd man out here but when i was looking at ecus cost was a big factor. I also didn't want something i needed to put together, i knew it would take me forever. Lastly i figured out what i wanted the ecu to be capable of.

To find something for less that 900 bones really hinders the search (buying new). My car was speed density from the factory so that eliminated PMS and quarterhorse.

The first megasquirt i looked at was the pnp. When i was investigating my wiring i realized it needed to be replaced. I really wanted fully seq inj. I decided to get the ms3x fully built, added the map daddy baro sensor (like the pnp comes with) and rtc module. puchased the 12 foot harness they sell. I am in it for less than the pnp plus a new harness from rjm. the widebands were extra.

So if i was to do it again, I would look at the ms3x or the pro m system. Reason for the pro m is the wiring harness. it is ready to go. Their coil on plug option is a good deal. By the time i get all the stuff i need to convert my car to coil on plug, i will have almost as much into my ms3x than their kit costs.

I am doing some expermenting with maf on my ms3x anyway.

 

What would be cool is a self learning/self tuning system that doesn't require any tuning and doesn't cost an arm and a leg.

 

You can't really self tune spark IMO. Maybe with an accelerometer but that would be pretty crude even then b/c there are so many other factors that can alter acceleration even back to back.

 

Really thinking about getting the diypnp megasquirt but have a few questions
1) how close do you think the base tune is on diy for the 5.0 as far as idle.
2) If I do work off the base tune how exactly do I rescale for injectors, I know you use the req fuel setting but does that get scaled into all your tables and settings automatically or do I have to do it myself somehow? I have been playing with tuner studio, so I guess its different when you actually have it plugged into the megasquirt.

 

Can't answer #1.

On #2, yes req_fuel is how you do it. There are a few places that this does not impact. Those places are where fuel is added/subtracted in units of time. Accel enrichment is one example, where you have a pulsewidth adder in milliseconds.

Any other tables which manipulate in fuel in percentages, like warmup encirhment, will scale when you calculate a new req_fuel number.

 

Thanks for the info. I found a lot of errors on the DIYAutoTune website. I thought this was just one more.

Here is one example:

DIYPNP Firmware Loading Walkthrough - DIYAutoTune.com

Step 4 - Flashing the Firmware

Instructions are incorrect: "...open the batch file program installed called "download-MS2-firmware.bat"
Change to read: "...open the file program called "ms2loader_win32.exe"

See Download & Installation on this page: Megasquirt MS2/Extra Loading firmware and Upgrade Notes

 

yea i have noticed that also. I think (and hope) what happened is the wording on stuff change and they never updated their website. I usually read the entire process a couple times before i do anything and then go ahead and do it.

 

Yeah it would be better if it was more clear that it could be either binary, depending on what firmware revision you're loading.