i think those are grade 8 anyways, never heard of any trouble with stock stuff

 

They make timing cover bolts...lower intake bolts....

nothing is "wrong" with them. The cam bolt is so small, torque capacity isnt a big deal like on head bolts....if you wanna get a new bolt for it, then do it, otherwise run the stocker.

I think its there simply for replacement sake....if you strip the head somehow or lose the bolt, arp has a replacement. They are a bolt manufacturer...

 

Yeh, The stock bolt has those 6 lttle notchs on the head which I believe means grade 8, so I think I'll just use the stocker and not worry about it. I guess all it really does is keep the eccentric and top sprocket tight. The dowel pin keeps everything in position. The bolt itself doesn't get a lot of stress.

 

The dowel pin is there exclusively as a locating device. The drive force is transmitted via friction between the sprocket and camshaft. This friction is directly related to the clamp load applied by the fastener. The stronger the fastener, the higher the torque value and the resultant clamp load. If for some reason this clamp load is reduced, the dowel often will shear

 

Just be sure to use Locktite and proper torque on the bolt. Comp says the biggest reason for cam failures is the cam sprocket bolt coming loose.

 

The stock bolt calls for #40-45# torque, so I thought I'd go the #45 lbs with plenty of the blue medium strength lok-tite on the threads. Does that sound good? I use the stuff from NAPA and it is Permatex brand but they still have the blue medium strength and the red high strength. Is the permatex brand OK rather than lok-tite brand? I used the high strength red on a alternator pulley nut one time, big mistake, it wouldn't even come loose with a impact wrench when I needed the pulley off. Nasty red stuff!

 

Don't overthink it. Put the stock bolt back - 40 lb-ft; some loctite. Fire that biatch up.

 

HEE-HEE, You make things too simple. You have to occasionally fret, stue, worry, overthink and eventually screw it up like me to feel like you've really accomplished something. Plus, the way I figure it, the longer I can delay this project, the longer it will be before I get my doors blown off. If he wasn't my son, the word 'Sabatage" could come into play.

 

I bought one since the my old one came out of block I split. . . . just a little piece of mind.

 

Yes, use the loctite. I made that mistake once. Cam bolt was torqued to spec, but no loctite. A few months later, the car just stopped running on me, no spark. Anyway, to make a long story short, the cam bolt came out, timing gear fell off, and the whole thing just stopped. Luckily I didn't bend any valves or anything. I'm still driving the car with the same motor in it. Bet your rear that I used loctite the second time.

 

5 bucks seams like cheap insurance to me so i have one . up to you though.

 

I'm just paranoid about this stuff, because so many times I have tried to improve something, only to have it go bad. We buttoned up the front of the engine tonight. We used the stock bolt, torqued it to #45 with blue lock-tite on it and called it a day.

 

NO, X1K....

 

That's the same exact answer I got from my girlfriend when I asked her to marry me!

 

Anyone know the torque of the ARP cam bolt?

 

Heh, ARP doesn't even have a specific torque valve for that particular bolt, they just send you right to a general torque sheet.

ARP is nice enough to have all their kit instructions online, searchable by kit number or application.

ARPinstructions.com | Kit Instructions and Torque Values

 

No problems. Thanks.

 

$9 for the bolt and washer, the bolt was way too long. So 40 cents for a nice grade 8 bolt at the hardware store and done.

 

Reading this thread has me pretty paranoid now. I tossed an ARP cam bolt in my build and I'm pretty much done putting it all back together. Torqued the bolt in per the ARP specs but I didn't use any loctite. Do you guys think this will be a big deal?

 

You're gonna want some loctite...

 

The stock fastener is fine for stock type applications, but for higher spring pressures and rpm I would use a stronger fastener with a higher preload capacity. Another important detail is to make sure the dowel does not protrude past the face of the sprocket. You definitely do not want any of the clamp load being applied to the dowel instead of the sprocket itself

 

Just buy one. The stock ford bolts are normally pretty good but arp are better. Find another $72 worth of arp bolts from jegs and place an order.


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Most of the solid roller cams that I've used in the last 10 years have been updated to 7/16" -20 bolt. That puts a little more clamp force against the cam and sprocket, holding it a little tighter. On those, I just use a rod bolt from a broken set of H beam rods that I had laying around. But I still had a dowel shear at one point. Bolt was tight but the dowel sheared (bolt not bottomed either). Never had the issue again after reassembly with a new dowel and re-using the same bolt with Loc-Tite.

I keep hearing about dual dowel pins on some solid roller stuff but I've never used them, and honestly don't even know where to pick up a sprocket with 2 holes. Mine is a pretty serious camshaft that needs a good bit of spring pressure, but I don't know if I would benefit from a second dowel or not when the time comes to replace the camshaft. I think I've been seeing more dual pins on the big block stuff, with 800+ lb springs and that sort of thing.

My brother sheared a pin in a 408 not long ago. Said it ran great, he shut it off and got back in it about 45 minutes later and it would not start-no compression. Pulled it apart and found dowel sheared, and the bolt was not exactly tight, maybe 35 lbs if I had to guess.. Made me think that the bolt was not stretched properly (tightened), or it did not have loctite. Or, could the rotation of the engine help to loosen the bolt somehow?

 

I think it is a good idea to use a dry torque spec when using loctite. If you use the arp spec for use with ultra torque, the target preload will be missed by a mile. With hardened loctite a fastener may feel tight with a wrench, but have a very low clamp load.

 

If you use a billet steel HR cam like FTI markets there is a good chance you will need an ARP 7/16 x 20 bolt which Ed is the only source I could find one. Part # ARP-SBF-CB2. The Lunati cam core doesn't use a standard bolt and washer.

 

How about the woodruff keys. Are there ones to avoid? I've heard of non hardened keys but not sure if they are the straight type like the stock crank or if they too come in the half moon type like the Scat cranks need...?

 

The half moon keys are woodruff keys. What is on the stock stuff is called a square key. The woodruff keys that come with scat cranks and stuff are just low carbon steel I believe. I'm sure you can buy better ones from an industrial supplier, but I haven't heard of anyone having problems with the supplied keys

 

Sweet. Problem is I didn't get any with my crank. I bought one to dial the cam. Now ready to put on timing set and tempted to use this one I have but not 100% confident it's hardened. I know if it fails it will destroy my heads. For the cost if new ones I'm gonna have to wait til next week to buy some.

 

They are run of the mill small block chevy keys and you are not going to shear 3 keys lol

 

Not to mention everything is clamped by the balancer bolt as well

 

The ones that came with mine are not hardened. They are sae 1035 steel, which is low-medium carbon steel and not particularly hardenable