How fast do you want to go? How much noise do you want to make? Street car? Want to use a factory hood?

There is never a replacement for displacement, but it all depends on how you plan on using it.

I had to start from scratch, so I built an NA Dart SHP 427w. Turns out I wanted a sleeper (something quiet) and I probably should have opted for a Turbo 351w...something without a big lopey cam and the rumble of large displacement.

Reliable 500 to the wheels is outside the realm of a production 302 block. My honest opinion...if you have the extra cash, start with a partial 4 main block like the SHP. Build it on the side, then do a swap.

Don't forget to take supporting mods into consideration...a $10k motor may cost you an additional $10k in supporting mods if you want 500hp. All the little things add up.

 

I chose 427 because it's nostalgic sounding name. It's going in a cobra. If I survive this build and do another fox I'd choose 363.

 

I'd go Windsor based 427 with a turbo, but I was at the "500 RWHP will be plenty" a long time ago.

 

Someone will always build something better, especially if your working with a budget. Put enough turbo, blower, and or N20 to a package and you can have a 4 cylinder embarrass the badest of the bad. What do you want? Street performance? Drag race success? dyno numbers for parking lot bragging??? What will make you happy?

 

I chose a 363 since it would look like a 302, be lighter weight than a taller block with the same parts, and fit like a 302. My primary goal was to have it look and fit like a small engine.

 

A 351W is 40 pounds heavier than a 302W.

 

Simple - cubes rule.

.454 Windsor.

:salute:

 

More cubes give you big torque and power at a lower RPM than a smaller sized engine...perfect for street use. This is NA applications of course.
Do you want 500 HP at 5500 or 500 HP at 6500 RPM?

 

Do a 572 in a stock block or 635 cu in in an aftermarket 460 variant. You can have 500hp at 3000 rpm or lower.

 

351w any stroke.

At 5300' with 8000 DA. This usually runs in the 8s. 560RWHP NA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReiGlR2hD8w

 

Drag race motors that can hold a full pull for 8 seconds and blasting the dunes for long periods of time are two different things. Cubes and not a ton of RPM is the key to reliable dune power.

 

Do the cubes unless you have a class rule to deal with.

I have a nasty 363, but I wish it was a 438.....

 

I would go with a 408W(Cheapest shortblock).

TFS 205 11R
Super Victor
Custom Hydrolic roller cam
850HP Holley Double Pumper Carb
Astro T5

550-575 FWHP.

 

That T5 would last about 3 seconds!

:salute:

 

They dont stay that heavy when you cut all the cylinder out of it to go large bore. Lots of that weight ends up on the floor in little shavings.

 

my aftermarket block is still heavy as #### at 4.125. the mains are much thicker than the stock Windsors I have sitting around.

 

450"-460" in a RDI/fontana/shelby block is the way id go
4.125 or 4.250 stroke with a 4.155 bore

will be an absolute torque monster down low. and with the right parts you can spin them to the moon

 

^^^ truth...but this will NOT be a cheap date . Engine builder has one in a sleeper/grudge car w/Victor heads & Progressive fogger...runs high 5's on motor( E85 street car)...and just a lil faster on the fogger. Block alone was $4,500+..not including machining. Another friend is doing a 461..same block,but using CFE heads/sheet metal intake..probably going to be a $20k + motor when done. Small blocks can get Rediculously expensive...but it is great to lift the hood after outrunning & taking $$$$ from a 632(or bigger)BBC car with 2 systems on it..with a grungy/greasy, flat black "351":evil: :leghump: I say a 408 in an early block if on a tight budget...or a 427-454 if you can afford an aftermarket block. If u NEVER plan on going over say~650rwhp or 7,000rpm on a regular basis..408 in stock block is the answer.

 

At that point, why keep playing with the little toys, same cost for everything, except maybe heads depending on ultimate goal. Go big block... RDI, 4.650 bore 4.75 stroke, 6.7 oliver rods. 645 cu in of fun.

 

i do know of a killer blue thunder headed BBF for sale right now... makes about 1300NA

 

Which heads? Im hunting some Thors.... Cs or some 441 B hemi heads... something to feed 635 cu in.

 

Thor gen 2 with a C&C 10.3 block

 

Aluminum block.... if I won the lottery, Id snatch it. What are they asking. 45k or so?

 

30K

 

Yes, Ive got the A460 block, and its a monster compared to a stock block. I pick up E7 460 block, move it around no problem. The A460, not going to bear hug it and move it. Walk that one across the floor or use hoist...

 

Thanks for the forward on the add. If I had two dpare dimes right now, that is a hell of a package. At a good price. Even if its hurt, block and heads alone cover the cost.

 

I would stay 408 to begin with on an aftermarket block with a P/A. Just in case you hurt the motor and need to bore the block again. N/A I would also do a 438. I cant afford a new dart block every rebuild. Good luck.

 

If you hurt it, odds are its junk, or neefs a sleeve. Saving bore for a hurt motor is a waist if build potential.

 

Agreed.

 

302 + aftermarket block+ forced air = 600rwhp.

Or...

418+ stock block + right combination of parts = 600 rwhp.

It's all bout how much you wanna spend and what your goal is.

 

Or...

418+ stock block + right combination of parts = 600 rwhp.

With all due respect, that's a bit optimistic....if you're speaking about an NA engine making 600 to the tire, with a stock block.

Not saying it can't be done, but that will NOT be a budget build.

 

I'm betting there are a fair amount of boosted 408's not making 600 to the tires. To me making numbers happen on a dyno is a lot harder than saying them on the internet. I've been to a few dyno days, and usually when someone makes over 500, people take notice, and the highest I've seen in person, "not you-tube" are 67xrwhp, and it was well over 100more horses between it and the next highest car out of at least two dozen pretty nice street cars that was at the last one I seen.

 

But its you 10,000 sheep, and god.......

A 408 and decent heads, a little compression, not that hard to do 600hp with a good head. Hell, back in the stone age I got it out of what is basically a K302 head, 3/4" headers, a 14-1 306 with a holley HP950.......

 

To the tire?

 

im thinking the 408 im building will get close to 600 at the tire with a set of SVA heads on it.

 

LOL good luck getting 600 RWHP NA on a 408.

People are way too optimistic here.

550-575 FWHP is realistic.