If you are not limited by space or class rules, why not add a 351 swap kit and a 351W based engine?

 

Well you have a pretty good build plan. You should do a compression and leak down test and check the oil pressure. If those check out, just check out how it looks when you go to put the top end on. Those are still pretty low miles and should be able to handle the mods if your short block's in good shape. Good luck and have fun with the build

 

there is nothing to gain. I would freshen it with rings and bearings and thats about it

if you are going to go with machine work and pistons, just bite the bullet and do a 347, its only a few hundred more


definately go with longtubes

 

not limited by class etc as this is a streetcar-weekend cruiser only...will do on the longtubes (though i heard that can cause cold start-up surges???)...dont want to get too crazy on the engine...just looking to make 325-375rwhp all said and done...(for now...eventually maybe ill add a turbo or something )....just didn't know if the machining was worth doing while the engine is ripped down. will do a compression and leak down test and check oil pressure. thanks

 

Did a 308 build here. Should have done a stroker honestly.
250$ 96' explorer engine.
467$ for boring and final hone. plus cleaning.
500$ for complete rebuild kit std bearings.includes forged pistons/oil pump.
300$ for engine balancing.
250$ for forged rods.
200$ for cam.
50$ stainless engine bolt kit 94/95
200$ canton oil pan that dont fit.
75$ flywheel.
300$ clutch.
800$ used aluminum heads.
200$ roller rockers.
100$ HARMONIC BALANER.
60$ water pump.
350$ intake manifold
200$ distributor.
$4142.00 For hopefully 300rwhp out of it.
It's not over yet lol. Cant get myself to reuse old parts with all this money invested in it. The tally keeps getting longer and longer as the build went on.
Just file fitting the pistons rings was enough to make me regret not just buying a shortblock/longblock. These are real numbers from my build.Did the work myself with a friend thats a ford mechanic by day and works at performance shop on side.

 

getting your engine rebuilt is the perfect time to bore out. My 89 is a 306 and i lot it.

 

If you got the money to do it, and want to. Then do it. lol.
If money is tight,there are other options. I was really surprised at what mine cost me in the long run. Like others are saying, for a small fraction more if i could go back id do a stroker 331/347. Cu inches baby! 408 windsor next time.

 

well the top end kit is around $2600...then im guessing by everyones numbers the to bore and buy new pistons etc is around $600-750ish...then another $400 for intake and throttle body...a few odds and ends $100-200...tune $600...then labor to install...so im guessing around $5000-5500...what would a stroker cost?

 

67K miles ? Seriously, unless that thing is smoking or making noise throw that top end kit on it and roll.

 

and or a used Blower :evil:

 

There is simply NO need in boring the block unless it needs it.You wont gain much of anything really.If you can leave it unbored your Much better off that way if you really need to bore it later on you can.

 

If you are paying for machine work go 347 it will only cost a little more at the end
if you wat over 325 rwhp you will need the 347

 

Agree with the 1st part, the 2nd part is made up though. There are guys on here documented with over 325whp and a stock 302 bottom end all motor. A properly set up 347 is good for over 400whp easy, if I had a 347 that wasn't making 400whp all motor (setup for NA) I'd be pretty pissed.

With that said, if you have 67k miles on the motor I would NOT touch the bottom end. Top end kit and go or piece one together yourself for a little less. Start with 300-325whp and then if you want more go power adder. If you have a Cobra just go power adder which is what I wish I had done in hindsight.

As for your plans:

when i go to do my engine rebuild i was wondering if it would be a good time to do this...car has 67kmi on it...dont know if its worth it or not and if i do im just wondering what i should expect to pay...i know i will need to pistons to i believe?


my engine plans for next spring so far are:

trickflow tfs-k514-360350B top end kit Great choice although you can piece together a kit from the classifieds here for a little less including a custom cam and a tom moss ported intake.
accufab 70-75mm throttle body good choice
msd cap and rotor Not really needed if your stock dizzy is still in good shape
msd tfi performance coil Stock coil is still fine or get a Crane, not MSD
msd 8.5mm super conducter wires The 8.5 wires are about the only good thing MSD makes IMO
bbk fp regulator It'll leak like a siv, get a Kirban AFPR
aem bruteforce cai The only CAI you should get is the AFM Power Pipe
70-75mm MAF ? 75mm Pro-M would be great

and a custom tune when its done... Basically required

not sure whether long tube or shorty headers...dr gas x pipe, spintech pro streets. Get longtubes, you'll be glad you did

smog delete and egr delete

let me know what you guys think. thanks :salute:

Hope that helped.

 

silversmith...thanks for the in depth reply...thats what i was looking for...you see the car had engine stuff when i bought it...how much or how little i dont really know b/c no-one made a proper "build sheet"....i know for sure it has

and this is a 93 gt hatchback

f303
gt40 upper intake (he said lower but lower looks stock)
bbk cai (fendermount)
stock maf and stock 19lb injectors
bbk 70mm throttle body (with egr spacer)
bbk fp regulator
bbk equal length headers
bbk h pipe
borla dumps
some cheaper rotor cap and bosch wires

i dont know how long this stuff has been on the car...i see the silicone seals on the intake are cracked so i know its been on there for a while...thats why i want to strip and build brand new off the block...im dumping alot of money into this car and im doing everything from cobra disc 5 lug conversion (done)....suspension, interior, audio, paint, etc...so i want to do it right...but also stay in some sort of budget. i plan on $4-5k on engine with labor.

should i go with a 75mm throttle body on my new setup? and anything else i should add/delete from my build...thanks again for all the help guys.

 

and this is a 93 gt hatchback

f303
gt40 upper intake (he said lower but lower looks stock)
bbk cai (fendermount)
stock maf and stock 19lb injectors
bbk 70mm throttle body (with egr spacer)
bbk fp regulator
bbk equal length headers
bbk h pipe
borla dumps
some cheaper rotor cap and bosch wires


should i go with a 75mm throttle body on my new setup? and anything else i should add/delete from my build...thanks again for all the help guys.

GT40 upper only works with GT40/Cobra lower and is a decent intake for what you want.
F303 cam, sell it for $75 and get a custom from FTI
Get some AFR 165 heads, some of the best for small cube setups
Headers and exhaust you have also OK
Get 75mm+ MAF and 24-30 lbs injectors.
70mm t/b u already have is more than enough.

With the right cam, above combo can make 300-325 rwhp and be very street friendly. Then add a 150 shot!

Work on suspension and say hello to low 12s if not high 11s.

 

who is FTI? also if i wanted to down the line...add a power-adder...are the afr heads better than the tw? want to swap the old rusty exhaust for something new...would like to ditch the upper/lower for something nicer/newer...glad to know its got a cobra lower though...

 

FTI is a custom cam grinder, Flowtech Induction. It's a toss up on which are better AFR or TW it all depends who you talk to and its been beat to death in this forum and many others. I have TW and the advantage with TW is greater pitons to valve clearance with 2.02 valves. If it was me I would just add a blower or turbo and be done. I did a head and cam swap this summer on my 94 Cobra and wish I just went with a power adder.

 

Unless the cylinders are worn or tapered leave them alone.

 

Most of us with Cobras wish we had just done power adders I think... Oh well, nice to have the weight reduction which is the main reason I'm not really regretting swapping heads. Not to mention I got $400 for my GT40s and only paid $700 for the Edels. Everything else I would have done anyway so $300 for aluminums is not bad in my book lol.

Ok Killer 5-0...

-You have a GT40 intake if you have a GT40 upper. GT40/Cobra/Explorer they are all the same flow wise. This is a VERY good intake for a 302/306 and it can be ported so it flows 240-250cfm meaning it will not choke off 165s or TWs. Tom Moss (tmoss on these forums) is the guy you want to talk to about getting it ported. I have a ported tmoss intake on mine and it is ####.

-F303 cam is not too bad but you might as well pull it out and upgrade it while you are doing the heads. FTI= www.flowtechinduction.com (Ed Curtis) and they do custom ground cams. Another great option is Jay Allen (www.camshaftinnovations.com). Cams are about $300 but will be customized exactly for what you want.

-AFR 165s or TWs are a wash. Even the Edels I have will get you to over 300whp easy and if you are going to do a power adder later then you'll be making enough power to split the block open anyway so the heads aren't the limiting factor. With that said, TW heads are probably the best bet IMO because they give you a ton of room to grow later if you want. Lots of "meat" on them for porters to work with. I got the Edels due to being a poor college kid at the time but am happy with them.

-70mm TB is fine, leave it on there, if the BBK FPR isn't leaking I'd leave it alone till you have a problem with it, they are very hit or miss but if it works ok more power to you. For exhaust if you go shorties then for SURE get the FRPP stainless headers (ceramics if you can afford it). Midpipe and exhaust is up to you... For longtubes the options are kind of limited to MAC and BBK and the quality is meh. Unless you are ok with spending $800-$1,000 then there are a bunch of higher quality stainless options. I'm actually installing a set of OBX stainless JBA knock off longtubes this weekend and I'll report on how they are. Welds are kinda crappy but we'll see.

 

thanks again...looks like i will probably piece together what i need...im also going to be showing this car which is why i want the engine to look nice as well...the lower intake on my current setup looks pretty damn rough...if i do decide to keep my gt40 can i get a new lower and if so which will i need? i dont mind spending $6-800 on a new upper/lower if its worth it. also i want to delete my egr...should i keep the bbk egr spacer and get a delete...or get a blank egr spacer? i guess ill just clean up the BBK FPR and the TB (though i like the look of the accufab "Big Daddy" )...get a afm powerpipe (3.5" im thinking)...custom cam...should i get the preassembled heads? i like the TW 170's idk y but i do...and what about a timing chain, injectors, pushrods, etc...dont want to have to go back in there once its all sealed up...thanks again guys i am completely new to this and i truly appreciate you taking the time to help me....

P.S. i would like to keep it N/A for now but still have the option for later

 

just quick...i found a sweet deal on a brand new 75mm accufab and egr spacer on another post...there is one left...should i get that instead of my bbk? or no?

 

Nope, inlet opening on a GT40 is 70mm so anything bigger is useless on that intake.

If you pay more than $100 for a new lower it is too much. Since you are going to delete your EGR, ANY GT40/Cobra/Explorer lower will work just fine. Just get a blank egr delete spacer or delete the spacer altogether if you want.

If you are going to show the car I would pull the intake you have off and get it show polished as well as have tmoss port your lower.

Timing chain, get a FRPP double roller, $50 and great. Injectors for a HCI car... 24s are good but if you are going to go power adder later you'll need to upgrade. Preassembled heads are fine, my Edels were although they were used so I had the springs checked to make sure they were still good which they were.

Pushrods you have to mock up and measure. Solid roller converted lifter, magic marker, digital caliper and adjustable pushrod for checking. Search on here how to check pushrod length.

Honestly though, if your budget is $4k you might want to just look at a Fordstokers longblock. Depends what your time is worth to you but if you get a motor from Woody you'll never have to worry about it being put together correctly or part quality etc... The stock block holding together with a power adder... that is a totally diff. story lol.

 

whats a fully assembled long block gonna run? how much would it be to have tmoss port?...i would love to go 400-450hp but i heard the stock tranny and rear end cant safely handle over 400hp? plus i rip on it pretty good on the street. what would you do for a simply street set-up?

 

Call Fordstrokers, talk to Woody and pick his brain, I can't speak for him plus every combo is going to be a little different... I've seen stock T-5s take 500hp, I've seen them break at stock levels... I'm not sure about Tom's prices either, they may have gone up or down since I had mine done and again, don't want to speak for anyone as to their prices. Pm tmoss for more info on his prices.

What I would do for a simple street setup? I already have a trans that can take 500+whp, the rear end is easy enough to swap out with something like a 31 spline Eaton and is an upgrade that anyone with decent power should probably do. I have the rear/axles in my basement, just need to get out there and install. What I AM doing is a decent flowing HCI and then a supercharger on top of it. IMO there is no need for more than 425-450whp on a street car but that's just me.

 

tell me what you think about this setup...

custom cam
bbk fp regulator
bbk 70mm throttle body w/ or without egr spacer (but deleteing the egr)
24lb injectors (what brand?)
afm power pipe (3.5")
tmoss ported gt40 upper/lower (also going to powdercoat it a custom color) or trickflow track heat?
twisted wedge preassembled 170 heads
frpp timing chain w/powdercoated or custom cover
crane coil
msd 8.5mm superconducter wires
70 or 75mm pro-m MAF
longtubes
dr gas x pipe
spintech pro streets

also have 5 lug cobra upgrade with NRC axles etc (made by yukon i think dont know if they can handle more than the stock)
3:73s

will i need lifters or do they come w/preassembled heads? also ill need pushrods...

i will probably want to add a supercharger later so which/what will work best for me given that info? 100% street car.
thanks

 

Your intake is a genuine FMS GT40 intake. If you want to make 325-350rwhp frpm a 302-308, your gonna have to nail a combo with even a ported GT40 intake which includes professional help with a cam. You'll need to get the cam right regardless with those cubes, but that power level will come a little easier with a Holley or TFS-R. If your engine had normal oil maintenance, you don't need a rebuild. You'll know for sure when you pull the heads and see if there is gunk in the lifter valley.

 

so it would be better for me to go with a different setup and lose the gt40 (though i read the gt40 can handle up to 425 or 450hp?)...i do like the look of the gt40 though. and which would better support a s/c? (again down the line)

 

With a supercharger, you'll make block splitting power over your HP goal with any good intake including the GT40, the GT40 just has a harder time getting to your 325-350rwhp goal N/A. The GT40 will likely make more torque over the rpm band below ~5,200-5,500 rpm and below where your boost curve is likely to kick in but the other intakes will make more peak power.

 

you want a budget build and make close to 300 hp here ya go. Explorer top end meaning heads, intake, and throttle body, injectors out of a truck with a 460 big block, mass air meter calibrated to them injectors and within 5 mm of the tb, keep the stock cam and go with a set of 1.7 rockers, 3.73 or a 4.10 and a decent breathing exaust system. You'll be in the high 12's with a little weight outa the car and a good hook prob make around 275hp and than wake it with some go juice and put that bastard in the 11's

 

so maybe i should just stick with my gt40...i usually shift b4 6k...around 5000-5500 so im looking for my peak hp to fit into that rpm band... if i end up with low 300rwhp then ill plan on adding a s/c...if i make more than that'll be great. i just wanted to make sure that the gt40's will still allow me to add a s/c in the future if i opt to do so. also im not necessarily looking for a budget build...i want to keep it below $5k with labor.

 

I like this...I also want to keep the torque low in the RPM range for fun street driving..Kenne Bell superchargers require a GT 40 lower to bolt onto...& maybe one other I forget now...TMoss gives great advice. Good luck & JYI my car has 150,000 miles on it & really GOOD compression so these 5.0's go a long time with a bit of care, yours most likely shows no wear yet!