Does anybody know what other year or make or model cars

I know Im quoting myself but;

Brakewarehouse.com lists the same pad (10X.05450) for 1993 cobra, 87-88 tbird turbocoupe and

1989 Ford Tunderbird v6 232CI 3.8L FI SC supercharged vin R

The pads are 114.2 x 59.6

and based on this, I got a hit on hawk pads website but not for ceramic, I gather that I should have the same front and rear pad types...?

Here is what I came up on www.hawkperformance.com

HB580E.627 Brake Pads; Blue 9012 w/0.627 Thickness; Rear;
HB580G.627 Brake Pads; DTC-60 w/0.627 Thickness; Rear;
HB580F.627 Brake Pads; HPS Performance Street w/0.627 Thickness; Rear;

Still want ceramic pads on all 4 corners...

 

You don't need ceramic in the rears (if they even make them).

 

So are you saying that I do not have to match front brake pad material with rear brake pad material or I should go organic *4 or semi metallic *4

 

D347 is the pad shape for the 93 Cobra/87-88 T-bird rear pad. Don't try and look it up by application, just use the D347 number. This is standard FMSI number used by the entire brake industry. Hawk uses HB580 for the D347 number. The letter after that indicates the compound. If you want to see of they offer the HB580 in a particular compound, call them.

 

D347 pads for rear 93 cobra/tcoupe to swap into 5.0 mustang

D347 is the pad shape ...standard FMSI number used

Thank you Jack you and qtrracer have helped me understand, I have another question;

reffering to the picture, the thickness is shown to be
16.7 mm = 0.6574803 inch

qtrracer when refering to the hawk pads (3 listed below) suggested that "D347 profile but it looks a little too thick at .627" for the vented rotors." All three are .627" but Centric pic shows .657 thickness is this measurement supposed to be the pad or the pad plus backing plate, how would I know if a profile would actualy fit

on Hawk's site I found 3 possible matches;
http://www.hawkperformance.com

Part # Description all 0.627 Thickness
HB580E.627 Blue 9012
HB580G.627 DTC-60
HB580F.627 HPS Performance Street


FORD 1989 THUNDERBIRD SC 3.8L : 232-cid : V6 FI : MFI Supercharged R


I am trying to get information not only for myself but I want to gather info on this subject and intend to create a feature on this on my website; www.thatmetalbox.com after I complete my upgrade. I will be using these posts unless there are objections I still need to locate a SVO proportioning valve and I have just removed the hard brake lines from a tbird, I will be trying to use the hard line that runs the length of the chassis as it is the correct diameter, I have been advised that too narrow ID of a line will not deliver the correct fluid; ie there will be too much pressure and not enough volume if the 5.0 mustang line is retained? Not sure how accurate this is but I will try it to rule out it as a failure

I would love to find a SVO to take its hard lines and pValve also as I am upgrading my 2 fox mustangs I could determine which combination performes best back to back comparision real world conditions

I am thinking that the DD car will be using the turbocoupe sway bars (thinner than 91 stock) as it will have higher rate springs and be lowered with drop spindles. The fun bracket car will be more stock suspension excepting 4 cylinder springs. Should provide good testbed for significent results

 

Thanks very much for all your help and suggestions folks! This is a truly great forum for the genesis and propagation of ideas. I found a rear pad, please help me understand:

--------------
Its a Semi-Metallic ceramic organic pad, is this possible?


Bendix D347 Semi-Metallic Disc Brake Pad
Price: $24.63
Ships from and sold by Amazon.com.

Product Features

* Features ceramic technology and organic friction
* Equipped with angled chamfers and premium noise insulators
* Excellent noise damping
* Corrosion resistant

Product Details

* Shipping Weight: 2.2 pounds (View shipping rates and policies)
* ASIN: B000C2JM46
* Item model number: D347

 

Aftermarket proportioning valves are not necessarily illegal. Brake system performance (on your car) is governed by FMVSS 105. The performance part of this standard only applies to manufacturers, not to the aftermarket or individuals modifying their own cars. It is illegal for anyone to defeat any of the safety features contained in all of the FMVSS (unless you have an exemption). An example of this would be to combine the front and rear hydraulic systems in a car to have common fluid passages.

Just use an adjustable proportioning valve, and adjust it properly.

 

Just use an adjustable proportioning valve, and adjust it properly.

And that IS the trick, isn't it. I've spent a great deal of time messing with this on my 86 using the SVO/Lincoln front caliper and SSBC rear conversion. Flat spoted some tires and finally got it close - I think. Then I changed to the MM PHB which seemed to reduce brake dive thus enhancing rear brake performance. Had to adjust again. Now, I've got the sn95 cobra stuff on the front and 17" wheels, and will need to mess with this again. Not really an issue unless you lock them up while trying this - and of course, that is sort of what has to happen. Never easy with these cars, LOL.

 

anyhow still lookin' for ceramic pads for rear could anyone wiegh in on the part I mentioned finding eariler:

Its a Semi-Metallic ceramic organic pad, is this possible?

Bendix D347 Semi-Metallic Disc Brake Pad
Price: $24.63
Product Features
* Features ceramic technology and organic friction
* ASIN: B000C2JM46

-------------------------- --------------------------

also some parts from

Listed on http://www.porterfield-brakes.com

Product No. AP545
R-4 - $185.95
R4-1 - $185.95
R4-E - $185.95
R4-S - $89.95

Interestingly it lists the application as

Rear for 86-92 Ford Taurus, Thunderbird

hmm ...looks like we've found another application for the D347 profile; does this necessairly translate over to "found another application for the ford/Varga 43mm rear caliper" ?

I dont know the differences between the different offerings...

 

also some parts from

Listed on http://www.porterfield-brakes.com

Product No. AP545
R-4 - $185.95
R4-1 - $185.95
R4-E - $185.95
R4-S - $89.95

Interestingly it lists the application as

Rear for 86-92 Ford Taurus, Thunderbird

hmm ...looks like we've found another application for the D347 profile; does this necessairly translate over to "found another application for the ford/Varga 43mm rear caliper" ?

I dont know the differences between the different offerings...

The letters indicate the compound and recomended use. Don't think so - the Porterfield choices have been available for some time. In fact, MM has the R4-S (street compound) listed as a very good match to a front Hawk HPS - I think I suggested Porterfield to you as option. Again, with a stock suspension the rear brakes provide about 20% of the stopping power. A super aggresive compound is not needed in the rear especially for a street car. The options you listed, from the Bendix through the new Hawk offereing, should give you more than enough alternatives for the intended purpose.

 

Once you have made significant changes to the cars weight distribution/tire sizes/tire grip/ front or rear brake sizes, the stock proportioning valve isn't going to have the correct knee point to get optimal braking. Remove it and install an adjustable model. They are not difficult to adjust properly, but unless you adjust it properly, your braking could be much worse.

Use a completely desserted road. Make sure the brake pads on the car are completely bedded to the rotors. Have a second person stand on the side of the road. Start off down the road, driving towards them. Once you have reached about 50mph, stop the car with the brakes as hard as you can, without locking up a tire. This will take practice to do. The vast majority of people have never done anything like this. DO NOT just stand on the brake pedal as hard as possible. You will ruin your tires. During the stop, the tires will just start to lock, as you are braking too hard. Ease of the brake pedal at this point to keep the tires from locking. This will require finesse. If the steering gets light, then the front tires are locking. If the car starts to yaw, then the rear tires are locking. Have your observer watch the tires on the car and tell you which are starting to lock up. Pop the hood, have them adjust the proportion valve to add brake pressure to the tires that are not locking up. Repeat this procedure several times until both front and rear tires lock up at the same time. Make sure to do this going both directions on the road. That will even out differences in road crown and surface grip.

Any pad with an FMSI number of D347 or D545 will fit any application that uses this pad number. In this case, Ford and Lincoln used this pad on at least 10 different applications. Aftermarket pad manufacturers frequently embed the FMSI number in their part number for a pad. That is what both Bendix and Porterfield have done in this case. Hawk and PFC do not do this. They use their own part numbers.

I have no idea if the Bendix pads will work well with the front pads you are looking at. Brake pad companies almost never provide any data that can be used to compare one manufacturers pads to anothers. You will have to try them to see.

 

Please post any part number of pads for the application missed so far

Use a completely desserted road.... hard as you can, without locking up a tire... DO NOT just stand on the brake pedal as hard as possible... You will ruin your tires... Have your observer watch the tires on the car and tell you which are starting to lock up...

Thank you, I have looked around for correct procedure and you have given me the most complete, I was going to go about it all wrong, I have older tires I thought to have two people, one on pass side one on driver side with video cameras and I was going to suddenly stand on the brake pedal, not caring about the tires, I will take your recommendation instead, thank you. BTW what is specifically wrong with my plan I have now discarded I am learning here thank you much!

I have no idea if the Bendix pads will work well with the front pads you are looking at. You will have to try them to see.

Thats too bad. 1 last Q: when you look at the bendix description, does it make any sense? Is it ceramic after all? ..It also says semi-metallic and organic! I though that it had to be ONE of those! Are there "mixtures" where ceramics are mixed in with metallic and or organic pad materials?
Thanks again Jack
Thanks again everybody, good info here and lots of the pad part # appear in this thread.

I ask; if anybody has other part numbers please post it here so a web search by random person will get the most possible info from this thread thanks

 

Most friction materials (brake pads, clutch discs, etc) are made up of multiple compounds. Metalic pads usually contain a high percentage of iron or copper, but they do have many other things in them. Ceramic pads may be mostly ceramics, but are going to have other compounds also. Organic pads are going to be mostly fibers of organic origin with resin to hold them together. There will still be some copper content in an organic pad for instance.

 

I have abrand new set of portfield pads for that application i have no use for....LMK
The part number is Ap 347 r-4 s Portfield brakes. They are 80.00 new but id give you a real good deal.

 

Thanks for the offer. As part of my discussions with discbrakesrus, we agreed that I could return the Hawk HB112F (D413) I purchased and exchange them for the new Hawk HB580F.627 (D347) just recently released. Otherwise, I'd snap-up those Porterfields.

 

some related info, and link

I have used both the 347 and 413 in my T-bird Varga calipers. According
to Porterfield, there is a 0.5mm difference in backing plate width and
height between the two outlines. Also, the T-bird version (347) is
several millimeters thicker. The Porterfield pads were $10 more for the
347, but the extra friction material thickness made up for the price
difference. It does seem easier to find performance pads for the 413
outline, though.

http://www.brazeauracing.com/mustang/tech/rearbrakes.txt

 

Some more info on the D413/D347 interchange.

http://forums.corral.net/forums/showpost.php?p=7777848&postcount=21

 

I got my ceramic pads at autozone of all places,"duralast brand"

I got them to get rid of my aftermarket rim dust shields, The wheels stay cleaner longer.
I didnt get them for a performace advantage if there is one, just wanted my rims to stay cleaner

 

I got my ceramic pads at autozone of all places,"duralast brand" I got them to get rid of my aftermarket rim dust shields, The wheels stay cleaner longer. I didnt get them for a performace advantage if there is one, just wanted my rims to stay cleaner

I completely agree, the ceramic dust is much lighter and does not stand out.

Additionally I have been reading that ceramic brakes are so much superior now compared to just a few years ago, since I have all new front and rear suspension including all new rotors (8 of them) I wanted to start out ceramic on the fresh surfaces...

here is some crap I had gathered please all debunk any lies contained within!!

http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/nov2002/mech.htm

Although first introduced as far back as 1985 on some new vehicles, mass after-market applications for ceramic-based disc brake pads are just now becoming widely available. Approximately 33 percent of all new vehicles, domestic and foreign combined, now have ceramic-based disc brake pads. The newest generation of ceramic brake lining compounds contain no chopped steel fibers or steel wool as found in earlier semi-metallic linings, but instead substitute ceramic compounds and copper fibers. These changes provide modern ceramic-based lining materials the capability of handling today's high brake temperatures with less heat fade, faster recovery time, and less wear on both the pads and rotors.'

Of even more value to brake repair facilities is the ability of ceramic lining compounds to significantly reduce annoying brake noise or squeal, which is the No. 1 consumer complaint relating to brake service. Ceramic compounds dampen noise and move brake pad vibrations to a frequency outside of our human hearing range, 20 Hz through 20,000 Hz. As with earlier disc brake pad designs, some ceramic pad applications may also incorporate other noise-reducing features such as chamfers, slots and insulator shims. One leading after-market manufacturer has gone as far as naming its line of ceramic brake pads "Quiet Stop."

__more___

Since they were first used on a few original equipment applications in 1985, friction materials that contain ceramic formulations have become recognized for their desirable blend of traits. These pads use ceramic compounds and copper fibers in place of the semi-metallic pad's steel fibers. This allows the ceramic pads to handle high brake temperatures with less heat fade, provide faster recovery after the stop, and generate less dust and wear on both the pads and rotors. And from a comfort standpoint, ceramic compounds provide much quieter braking because the ceramic compound helps dampen noise by generating a frequency beyond the human hearing range.

Ceramic pads meet or exceed all original equipment standards for durability, stopping distance and noise. According to durability tests, ceramic compounds extend brake life compared to most other semi-metallic and organic materials and outlast other premium pad materials by a significant margin - with no sacrifice in noise control, pad life or braking performance.

This is quite an improvement over organic and semi-metallic brake materials that typically sacrifice pad life to reduce noise, or vice versa.

__more___
Ceramic Brake Pads

Performance Ceramic Brake Pads Correct Applications
Ceramic brake pads are widely used in today's marketplace as replacements for OEM and asbestos pads. The long life and increased stopping power alone are great advantages over traditional pads. When you consider the added benefit of heat retention in the pads, which promotes extended rotor life and prevents warping, ceramic brake pads are the smart choice for the consumer who wants performance and long life.

The use of performance ceramic brake pads is highly suited to the street performance market. This includes high line cars such as BMW, Audi, Mercedes, and other European as well as American performance automobiles. Also included in this market are performance street rods and muscle cars. Performance ceramic brake pads are best suited for cars between 2800 and 3200 lbs.

What are the Benefits of Ceramic Brake Pads?
One of the main advantages of ceramic brake pads is the ability to draw heat into the pad and away from the rotor. Heat on rotors causes warping of the rotors, so the heat absorbed into a ceramic brake pad helps preserve the life of the rotors. Ceramic brake pads are more efficient than older asbestos pads and have much greater stopping power. This translates into a pad that lasts longer than traditional brake pads with increased on road performance.

Not all Ceramic Brake Pads are Created Equal
Not all ceramic brake pads are the same. There are countless different mixes of ingredients and materials that make one pad better than another.

 

The last paragraph about ceramic pads pulling heat out of rotors is total bunk. If it does have lower thermal resistance, that is a huge problem. The brake pad doesn't have any significant thermal mass compared to the rotor. If it does pull more heat out of the rotor, it will have virtually no effect on reducing the brake rotor temperature. What it will do is cause the brake fluid to instantly boil. One of the largest advantages of brake pads made in the last 20 years is that the friction material is a good thermal insulator. This allows the brake rotors to be hot enough to glow orange while keeping the brake heat from getting to the brake fluid.

Modern Mercedes and BMWs are the best possible examples of cars with OEM pads that have horrible levels of brake pad dust. I doubt that either company is really using ceramic pads from this standpoint.

The biggest difference I see between semi-metalic pads and ceramic pads is that the metal in semi-metalic pads is always iron. When the brake dust gets on your wheels, the iron rusts, forming a layer that adheres to the wheel and doesn't come off easily. If the ceramic pads don't have iron in them, they won't rust on the wheels.

 

On aside note, I have a ceramic based clutch on my old Corvette, the last one rusted to the flywheel since the car is only driven sporadically in the Summer and Fall. Couldn't break free, had to drop the tranny.

 

An 89 Taurus SHO has the same rear calipers as the 88 TC rear.

 

Thank you keithnra. I had not looked at this thread for a bit. I did buy a car for this brake system (sounds backwards, huh? but not for a mustanger) here it is:

http://www.thatmetalbox.com/Automotive/1992NotchbackStroker/

Its a 1992 Ford Mustang Notchback Stroker!

 

I have just found out...

There are ceramic pads available for the D347 T-bird calipers, the Bendix D347CT or D347 pads.

 

Actually there are 4 offerings now on summitracing! Nice! Last year there were none


Baer Holdings
Manufacturer Part Number D0347
Product Line Baer DecelaPads Brake Pads
$62.95


Bendix Brakes Bendix Brakes
Manufacturer Part Number D347CT
Product Line Bendix Brakes CT Ceramic Brake Pads
$40.95

Bendix Brakes Bendix Brakes
Manufacturer Part Number D347
Product Line Bendix Brakes CQ Ceramic Brake Pads
$28.95

EBC Brakes
Manufacturer Part Number DP31172C
Product Line EBC Redstuff 3000 Series
$84.95