[Angus]

Well, I don't have the funds to lump into one of thse motors, even a used one. And I'm planning on making more power than they are rated at, so I'd have to spend even more on it after I got it. That simply doesn't make good sense to me. That manifold would be incredible if it wasn't cast from unobtanium.

How much power is the FR500C engine rated at?

I've never seen that information anywhere, only that it was "Around 500 rwhp".

How much rwhp are you shooting for?

As far as $ goes, you could always buy the entire engine, keep the intake & resell the remaining parts...

 

[olgreydog7]

As far as $ goes, you could always buy the entire engine, keep the intake & resell the remaining parts...

Yea, and end up with a $17k intake? How much do you thing a used long block would go for?

 

[na svt]

Yea, and end up with a $17k intake? How much do you thing a used long block would go for?

I don't think that intake will work well at 9k either.

 

[88saleen697]

The info I have seen rates that engine at 400-450+/- flywheel. Not nearly what I'm looking for. It's only 11:1 compression, I plan on running 12.5:1. The pistons and the cams would have to be changed, which is going to be a $2500 expense right there with the gaskets and balancing. If I'm going to spend that, I might as well do it on my own engine, because it's not like I'l have people standing in line offering top dollar for the old parts. I'm going to have well over $10K in the stock bore motor over a course of a year. I only paid $2500 for the car.

And I'm honestly growing tired of hearing that the GT head is the wrong way to go. My 138 cubic inch 4-cylinder race motor had a head that flowed over 300 cfm at .450" lift. The port was fairly stock, the only work was in the bowl and a very trick valve job. The exhaust side of the head received a bit more work and the port was opened up to the 1-3/4" header. That car was beyond potent.

I'm using the same build approach here. The GT heads will not get any larger from porting, but they will see a little intake bowl work, and the exhaust side will get bowl and roof work. The valve job will bring it all together. When I'm done, I expect to make nearly 500whp from a stock bore motor. As much as everyone will call it a pipe dream. The fact is, my 4-cylinder race motor made 240whp with less than half the displacement and less than 7500rpm.

I'm going to procede with the project. The more I hear it can't be done, the more motivated I get.

 

[na svt]

And I'm honestly growing tired of hearing that the GT head is the wrong way to go. My 138 cubic inch 4-cylinder race motor had a head that flowed over 300 cfm at .450" lift. The port was fairly stock, the only work was in the bowl and a very trick valve job. The exhaust side of the head received a bit more work and the port was opened up to the 1-3/4" header. That car was beyond potent.

It's not about how much (CFM) the GT heads flow, it's about the velocity of the charge and with only 281 cubic inches the charge velocity will be very slow. For example, I know of a 281 ci motor that made peak power at 8500rpm with extensively C heads. Replacing those heads with C heads that have smaller intake ports (not opened up as much) resulted in more hp and tq but the peak power occured at the same rpm.

 

[olgreydog7]

I'm glad to see that you are still going to try. I hope it works out for you. Did you decide on an intake? Keep us posted with pics and numbers as you get them

 

[Angus]

I just threw the FR500C intake/engine out there as an option because it seemed suitable for your needs.

That + the fact that there's so few intake manifolds available for the 4.6 4V

Guess I was wrong...

 

[Modular Depot]

How much power is the FR500C engine rated at?

I've never seen that information anywhere, only that it was "Around 500 rwhp".

How much rwhp are you shooting for?

As far as $ goes, you could always buy the entire engine, keep the intake & resell the remaining parts...

Our FR500C makes 420 at the wheel.

Greg

 

[na svt]

Our FR500C makes 420 at the wheel.
Greg

WoW! That's a lot of money for 420rwhp.

 

[88saleen697]

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[88saleen697]

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[88saleen697]

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[88saleen697]

There is no way I'd spend 10x what I paid for the car on a motor that didn't meet my specifications. I'm looking for closer to 500rwhp and with some of the research I've done the past few days, that's a real possibility.

As I stated in an earlier post, I have a line on a worthy manifold through a good contact. He promises I won't be disappointed, but won't tell me any more than that. I should have more information soon, and I promise I'll share the info.


I've found some very cool valvetrain bits that no one advertises as fitting these engines. It turns out that with the amount of duration I want to run, the valve lift will require a higher installed height on the valve springs, and in turn, I found springs that are a perfect compliment to the planned combination. So the valvetrain may be fairly well sorted.

I have a piston manufacturer willing to make my pistons with domes and valve reliefs from my CAD files, a very cool deal there. Plus, they will make them with a smaller diameter narrower pin, cutting down the total piston weight without any loss of strength. It means if I run an off the shelf rod I'll end up putting a smaller bushing in the small end, but that I don't mind.

I'm shooting for having this thing up and running by next spring. So given where I'm at now, with what I have and What I need, things should come together pretty well.

 

[mark88]

As I stated in an earlier post, I have a line on a worthy manifold. Sheet metal?

 

[Angus]

Holy quadruple post! :lol:

 

[mark88]

http://www.kinsler.com/page--Ford--16.html The n/a h.p. list what is close to the top ? Joe Hutchins (475) 5.3L(SHM), Ported B head/Cams/Kinsler IR intake/RG. B Head HP Champion.

 

[tmhutch]

It's not about how much (CFM) the GT heads flow, it's about the velocity of the charge and with only 281 cubic inches the charge velocity will be very slow. For example, I know of a 281 ci motor that made peak power at 8500rpm with extensively C heads. Replacing those heads with C heads that have smaller intake ports (not opened up as much) resulted in more hp and tq but the peak power occured at the same rpm.

+2, do not hamstring your build with the GT heads. 281 cubic inches cant even produce power with a B head, let alone a GT head. You can get all the RPM you need from a properly prepped 03-04 C head. They can flow upwards of 330 CFM and they are a dime a dozen. 8500 RPM? No problem. And with the C head you get VELOCITY, which is just as important as CFM at those RPMs because the scavenging affect is critical. You may want to keep arguing but any major engine builder who knows the Ford DOHC will tell you the same thing.

Good luck with your build. Sounds like it's going to be a killer. Keep us posted.

Todd

 

[na svt]

As I stated in an earlier post, I have a line on a worthy manifold through a good contact. He promises I won't be disappointed, but won't tell me any more than that. I should have more information soon, and I promise I'll share the info.

The GT head's bolt pattern/port location is different from all other B heads. Will the intake you have in mind it fit GT heads?

I've found some very cool valvetrain bits that no one advertises as fitting these engines.

I know of three companies that make solid lash adjusters and upgraded followers for these motors, one is L&M and another is Jesel (can't remember the third). I've heard they make more power but have seen nothing about their reliability. You may want to check with one of the mod motro builders that has experience with 9k motor and these aftermarket valvetrain pieces.

It turns out that with the amount of duration I want to run, the valve lift will require a higher installed height on the valve springs, and in turn, I found springs that are a perfect compliment to the planned combination. So the valvetrain may be fairly well sorted.

How will the duration affect the lift lift you will be required to run? The lift should be determined by the flow capability of the heads and also the valvetrain's ability to control the valve's opening and closing at 9k. Also, your valvetrain geometry will be all jacked up if you run longer valve stems...especially if you use non-adjustable adjusters/followers.


The kinsler type manifold is the way to go and is proven to work and is very tunable...good choice.

 

[massacre]

...

 

[Angus]

The kinsler type manifold is the way to go and is proven to work and is very tunable...good choice.

How much are the Kinsler intake manifolds for the 4.6 4V?

I looked on their site briefly & couldn't find a price listed.

I've seen them before on Cobra kit cars, but no one has ever mentioned cost...

EDIT: After some searching, it seems they cost in the $3500 - $4000 range. :eeek: