What does it take to run 11s in 97 cobra

zak97cobra · Oct 27, 2005

I meant of the three of us.

Good luck Mark

.

na svt · Oct 27, 2005

zak97cobra said:
If you had any clue as to the history of Andy, Bill and me and what we (among others) have tried to accomplish over the last 5-7 years with B heads, you'd have shut up a long time ago. Look at my sig, I'm the only one still trying to get his B-headed, stock long block (including intake) into the 11s. It's not something you just show up to the track and do.

I know ya'll have spent a lot of money and time testing and racing these engines and know what works and what dosen't, I'm not doubting that. I've learned quite lot from the more knowledgeable people here. But, there are quite a few that think there is only one way to get there and get quite defensive when othere question them.

What's up the the "shut up"? I haven't bashed anyone or told anyone to "shut up." Lighten up and pull your panties out of your crack and get on with the discussion.

I'm just saying it can be done. I know the other heads are better options for n/a applications but there is an added expense. How large that expense is determined by who does the work on them and some charge a lot more than others.

napsterstang said he wanted 11s. Jims car went 11 flat with very mild port work, cams and intake. Add 500 pounds to jims car and you still have 11.5s-11.6s. That sounds like 11s to me. And for much less than a head/intake swap.

Quick Snake · Oct 27, 2005

NA SVT What does YOUR car run? You post above about proving doubters wrong....what have you proved? Me, Andy, and Zak have all been low low 12s NA with the stock motors. Nobody has to prove anything to us when it comes to these setups because we all raced them for years. Like I said above 11.70s are possible in a big geared, lightened, slick and skinny race car. Look up SVTCAMR for a good example of what can be done with stock heads and some well chosen mods. For the money it would cost you to replicate what Jim has into his heads you could have done the 03/04 swap without a problem, and thats not even getting into his list of custom made one off parts. I talk to Jim all the time and its very impressive what he has accomplished with his car.....its just the not simplest way to go about going that fast.

zak97cobra · Oct 27, 2005

na svt, it's pretty insulting for me to give advice and then have someone like you sit back and internet race about the value of b-heads on a stock N/A engine. Throw Jim out the window, he's an exception. The thing you don't know about is the numerous people that tried to get their N/A B head cars into the 11s over the years and just gave up because they couldn't do it. I think I can count on my right hand the number of B head cars in the 11s N/A. And how many have done it with the stock intake? 1? 0? How many have done it with C heads?

Fourcam330 · Oct 27, 2005

na svt said:
I know ya'll have spent a lot of money and time testing and racing these engines and know what works and what dosen't, I'm not doubting that. I've learned quite lot from the more knowledgeable people here. But, there are quite a few that think there is only one way to get there and get quite defensive when othere question them.

Personally I don't care what you run on your car. Facts are facts, and when it comes to naturally aspirated performance there's nothing to debate anymore. We already know the answer.
B heads are 13 years old at this point, does it really surprise you that something much better has come along since? Let it go, they were good for '93 not '03, and definitely not '05.

I'm just saying it can be done. I know the other heads are better options for n/a applications but there is an added expense. How large that expense is determined by who does the work on them and some charge a lot more than others.

The added expense in going tumble port you're talking about amounts to around $200-400 after reselling your working stock B heads/intake. For the kind of power/TQ you gain, that's $ well spent, in fact much better than any bolt on I can think of.

napsterstang said he wanted 11s. Jims car went 11 flat with very mild port work, cams and intake. Add 500 pounds to jims car and you still have 11.5s-11.6s. That sounds like 11s to me. And for much less than a head/intake swap.

Get off Jim's jock for a minute please. No one else in their right mind is going to remove that much weight, drive a synchroless trans on the street, etc. Again, a light car plus a great driver/chassis/susp. always makes for a quick/fast car. His car would no doubt be quicker/faster with tumble port heads, end of story.
No way in hell that car runs 11.5s-11.6s with an extra 500lbs. That much weight would put a serious hurting on the torqueless B head motor.

na svt · Oct 27, 2005

Damn, I've been :hammer:'rd

Okay, okay, I have always agreed with you that the other heads make more power. I've never disputed that.

However, I will dispute the cost differential as B-heads are a dime a dozen and can be had for $200, complete.

Dang, now that i've spent all this money on my engine what do I do with the B-heads? I do have a library that needs bookend.

slobra281 · Oct 27, 2005

I ended up spending $100 on my 03 Mach 1 heads complete with cams and cam covers. I sold my B-heads complete w/o cam covers for about $400 and then stumbled upon the low mileage 03 jewels for $500.

JIMS SVT · Oct 27, 2005

zak97cobra said:
And how many have done it with the stock intake? 1? 0?

I have.Ive also done it with stock manifolds and k member a arms.

JIMS SVT · Oct 27, 2005

Fourcam330 said:
drive a synchroless trans on the street,

Whos has one of those?I might looking to getting one of those.

zak97cobra · Oct 27, 2005

JIMS SVT said:
I have.Ive also done it with stock manifolds and k member a arms.

I know.
How many off the shelf parts did you have when you did it? Can napsterstang get those parts today? What did your car weigh? Can napsterstang duplicate your setup while keeping his car streetable? Jim I don't mean to take anything away from what you've accomplished but you're not the norm.

JIMS SVT · Oct 27, 2005

zak97cobra said:
I know.
How many off the shelf parts did you have when you did it? Can napsterstang get those parts today? What did your car weigh? Can napsterstang duplicate your setup while keeping his car streetable? Jim I don't mean to take anything away from what you've accomplished but you're not the norm.

I had a 2 1/2'' off road x pipe,3'' one chamber flows,steeda pulleys,intake tube,ported stock maf,imrc delets,upper and lower control arms,removed front swaybar,mail order chip,k&n,slicks,skinneys,racing seat,rear seat delete,spoiler off,sub frames,456 gear,axles,pro 50 shifter.I think thats about it.It went 11.94@113 with a 1.55 60.

Fourcam330 · Oct 27, 2005

JIMS SVT said:
Whos has one of those?I might looking to getting one of those.

Thought you already had one, what kind of trans are you using now?

Fourcam330 · Oct 27, 2005

JIMS SVT said:
I had a 2 1/2'' off road x pipe,3'' one chamber flows,steeda pulleys,intake tube,ported stock maf,imrc delets,upper and lower control arms,removed front swaybar,mail order chip,k&n,slicks,skinneys,racing seat,rear seat delete,spoiler off,sub frames,456 gear,axles,pro 50 shifter.I think thats about it.It went 11.94@113 with a 1.55 60.

That furthers the point that the only way a full weight, full interior car is going to run 11s N/A and still exhibit good drivability is with tumble ports. Didn't you make your control arms yourself?

slosvt · Oct 27, 2005

Wow, this thread got interesting...

Chaulk me up as anther one that was trying to get in the 11's NA with B heads and stock motor (TB-Oilpan). 12.09 with a DA around +1k and all the aftermarket parts you can have. G force, built rear, full suspension and a race weight of 3125. After spinning some rod bearings, I couldnt see not building the bottom end up and putting some hogged out 03 heads with aggressive cams and a short runner intake in place of the B heads... After seeing what Ken B's car has ran with a similiar setup, I am very glad with the choice I made.

JIMS SVT · Oct 28, 2005

Fourcam330 said:
Thought you already had one, what kind of trans are you using now?

Helical syncro g-force t5

na svt · Oct 28, 2005

JIMS SVT said:
I had a 2 1/2'' off road x pipe,3'' one chamber flows,steeda pulleys,intake tube,ported stock maf,imrc delets,upper and lower control arms,removed front swaybar,mail order chip,k&n,slicks,skinneys,racing seat,rear seat delete,spoiler off,sub frames,456 gear,axles,pro 50 shifter.I think thats about it.It went 11.94@113 with a 1.55 60.

Great e.t. for not having headers, short runner intake intake, or a dyno tune and the only weight removal being a-arms, rear seat, sway bar and skinnies.

Fourcam330 · Oct 28, 2005

na svt said:
Great e.t. for not having headers, short runner intake intake, or a dyno tune and the only weight removal being a-arms, rear seat, sway bar and skinnies.

I agree great ET/MPH for the mods, but most people probably aren't going to want to drive around with 1 seat in the car.

JIMS SVT · Oct 28, 2005

na svt said:
Great e.t. for not having headers, short runner intake intake, or a dyno tune and the only weight removal being a-arms, rear seat, sway bar and skinnies.

It had stock a arms on it too.But that doesnt matter.its just a b headed car that noone wants to mess with.

2001cobra · Oct 28, 2005

Fourcam330 said:
$800-1000 for 03/04 heads
$750 for Al's basic clean up port/VJ (exhaust, short turn) including milling for more compression, a Serdi 5 angle VJ with hand blend, and assembly.
$1500 for the FR500 cam/VT kit
$400 for an Avi and anther ~$700 for Al to port/massage it.

Total: $4150-$4350 for ~400rw on the stock bottom end. You will also need rails, an adj. FPR, and an aftermarket coolant guage.

If I where to keep my 01 heads on the car and just swap the cams and intake could i expect around 375 at the wheels?

Fourcam330 · Oct 28, 2005

2001cobra said:
If I where to keep my 01 heads on the car and just swap the cams and intake could i expect around 375 at the wheels?

Something around there, possibly higher. Depending on how good the casting quality of your particular heads are a 10-20rw difference.

What does it take to run 11s in 97 cobra

zak97cobra

na svt

Quick Snake

zak97cobra

Fourcam330

na svt

slobra281

JIMS SVT

JIMS SVT

zak97cobra

JIMS SVT

Fourcam330

Fourcam330

slosvt

JIMS SVT

na svt

Fourcam330

JIMS SVT

2001cobra

Fourcam330

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