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Discussion Starter #1
Quick background, picked up a 95 cobra with a freshly rebuilt 306 and tremec 3550 and some suspension work. I usually go for engine upgrades first but since it’s a fresh rebuid I figured I’d try setting up the suspension first this time around.
I’m new to suspension so I don’t know a whole lot about it. From I was told and can see the car has the following,
Front:
-Front MM 300lbs coilovers kit with tikico struts (not positive on spring rate but they do feel really stiff)
-Stiffer front sway bar
-MM caster/camber plates
Rear:
-Rear non adjustable MM LCA
-Rear BBK springs (unknown rate)
-Subframe connectors BBK (welded)
-Tokico shocks
The torque boxes look in good condition but still wanted to reinforce them before the do go bad, I also noticed the differential is not center it’s maybe 1/2 inch give or take shifted to the driver side (no noticeable wreck damage anywhere). At first I was thinking of doing the BMR torque box reinforcements that also use the chassis for support, but then I came across the MM torque arm with PH bar which would help center the diff, and then the TeamZ upper relocating control arms with their anti roll bar, so now I’m all over the place since I’m not sure what would work best for me. Which kit do you guys think this car would benefit from?
This is 99% street driven, more of a stop light to stop light and hard acceleration out of corners kinda of car, might see the strip 1-2 a year if that. I would eventually like the car to make somewhere 400/400. I think I would be pretty satisfied with that. Any input would be appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yea I’ve heard MM is top quality and looks nice as well but as far as performance do you think the torque arm with PH bar will perform better than the TeamZ relocating upper control arms with their antiroll bar?
 

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I think for a street car the MM stuff will be better, the TeamZ products seem to be focused on getting yo the best ET not the best handling. Basically it's an apples v oranges situation and if I was in your position I would go with MM.
 

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As for the TeamZ ARB. This is a drag racing specific setup. It's not a sway bar. I've herd TeamZ recommends unhooking the link just to get car off the trailer.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

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I have a MM torque arm and panhard bar, my car is a street car that sees the strip once a year if that. The PhB/TQ arm setup completely changes how the car drives. You end up with miles of grip in the corners, it hooks up really well when i get on it as well. The car does not rear up, it just goes! And when you brake the whole car seems to squat instead of having nose dove. One of the best mods i have ever done to the car. This is also setup with 250# hyper coils and the lower spring rate tq arm springs for hooking up better from a dig.

My cars setup is a forged 2v, ported hesds 9.5:1 cr, p51intake with a turbo setup on the car, so it has some power to it. 3650 manual, 3.27 gears and 315 r888 tires. I will say that if the car does break the tires free, the car stays dead straight. I no longer have to worry about snap oversteer and playing the deadly chicken dance.

Bottom line. It wont feel like a mustang anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
That is correct, I read in their website that they recommend disconnecting the link for street driving. It does seem like more of a drag race application. I guess I was thrown off due to this one guy that installed it and was bragging about how much better his car felt.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Lower spring rate? It seems like MM recommends higher spring rate for the rear with the TA/PH set up. Or is that just if you have front coilovers?
 

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Lower spring rate? It seems like MM recommends higher spring rate for the rear with the TA/PH set up. Or is that just if you have front coilovers?
Yes, you need stiffer springs in the rear if you're running a TA/PHB setup. I think Snorky was referring to the fact that MM offers two different options for the TA springs: 375-440 or 415-515. I'm assuming he has the softer set because he's running 250# coilovers up front; if he was running something stiffer up front the stiffer TA might be required. I don't know what the break-point is between the two.
 

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With a T/A, the upper arms are removed. Thus, you also need a PHB for lateral axle control. With the uppers gone, all of the bind inherent with the stock converging 4-link is eliminated. Therefore, more rear spring rate is required. How much more is a function of your front wheel rate.

Assuming the front C/O spring rate is 300# (BTW, Hyper springs have the rate engraved into the pigtail), your front wheel rate is 255#. Thus, a rule of thumb is that your rear wheel rate should be about 100# lower. According to MM's tech, their conventional T/A spring is adequate for a front C/O rate of between 225 and 325#. If you chose the MM suspension option which I also recommend, then your front spring rate will work assuming it is within the above range.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I’m not sure I understand that, if I have a 300lbs how/why does that make my front wheel rate 225? I will try and get under the car this weekend to see if I can check exactly what coilovers I have.
If I could get away with running the lower spring rate 375-440lbs I think that would kinda give me the best of both worlds like snorky said.
 

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The spring rate is one of the last thing that is selected when designing a given suspension.

The more binding a given suspension design has, the less spring rate is needed at that end of the car. How the car is used has a very large affect on the spring rate needed. The more handling oriented the car is going to be, the stiffer the overall spring rate needs to be. Our recommendations about installing stiffer rear springs when a TA is installed are based on the fact that most of our customers are interested in better handling.

Spring rate by itself doesn't matter. What matters is wheel rate. This is spring rate corrected by the installation ratio of the spring with other things added in such as suspension geometry binding. If you move the rear wheel upwards 1" on your Mustang, the spring is only compressed about 0.66". This means that the wheel rate is about 0.5 times what the spring rate is (0.66*0.66). So a 250lbs/in spring mounted on the RLCA has a wheel rate of about 125lbs/in. There are similar correction factors applied to coilovers mounted in the front or rear suspension.

Everything we do with a customer will be based on the customers car (meaning all of the suspension parts, wheels and tires on it) in addition to how the car is driven and what type of performance the owner wants from it.
 

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I have the MM torque-arm setup on my FOX as well, and my uncle has a similar setup on a vintage 65. I am convinced that the torque-arm suspension is the best setup for overall performance on a solid axle setup.
 

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I had the MM TA/PB on my 95 cobra for ten years. There should be a law that all 78 thru 04 mustangs must have the MM ta/pb. Handling went from white-knuckles to "confident" immediately.

... that said, any Honda Civic is still going to enter a turn faster than you are. Mustangs have a high CG and the suspension was designed in 1974. The MM parts will make for more confident commuting, but their main value is to the guys who road race. If I still had my stangs, I would definitely put the MM parts on.

... keep in mind that you will also need full length subframes.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Whoa some if this info goes way over my head. I’ll have to do some reading up on it. But it does seem the TA/PH is the way to go for street driving. So far on my list I have the TA, PH bar, rear springs, I’ll have to call MM and see what spring rate they recommend once I know exactly what rate coilovers I have up front.
As for the rear LCA id like to get the MM adjustable ones but I see that none of the ones they offer have the adjustment to move the differential front/back, they only have ride height adjustment. Is that because it’s set and not needed once you install the TA?
 

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In general there is no need to adjust the fore/aft position of the axle assembly in the rear of the car. Having RLCAs with an adjustable height lower spring perch is very useful for adjusting the rear ride height and is absolutely required to corner weight the car.

For cars with rear coilovers, we do have RLCAs which allow their length to be adjusted. This might be done in some race classes to improve the weight distribution and still stay within a wheelbase limit.
 

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I had the MM TA/PB on my 04 and it was way better for overall driving compared to relocated uppers and adjustable LCAs. When I switched to drag only, I pulled the MM stuff off and put it in the shed in case I ever want to build another street New Edge.
 
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