[Ryno22980]

I am considering getting Microsquirt next year to start to learn to tune with my near stock setup. I'd want to gain a decent level of familiarity tuning with TS before either adding a turbo or a H/C/I to my car a year later.

I'm in research mode and have a couple of questions:

1. What do you MS guys do with your EVAP/charcoal canister system? I wouldn't mind deleting it all as I don't need any emissions crap on the car. However, I don't want my garage to smell like gas all the time so just venting it to atmosphere doesn't sound appealing.

2. I'm leaning toward Microsquirt while turboing the stock long block. I have a 255 lph fuel pump and stock injectors (34lb) off a friend's 2011 Coyote mustang that I would like to use. I am running a junkyard 70mm MAF off a 94 GT so the cost savings of going MS and not needing to buy a new blow through MAF would be nice. I also think learning to use TunerStudio looks much less confusing/intimidating than using Binary Editor with QH. I already have a WB and feel that I am patient and studious enough about learning to tune. How does this plan sound?

 

[JFraser27]

Sounds like you have the right idea. Get to know the system before you go crazy with your build. As far as the canister goes as long as your state inspection doesn’t require it then I’d just toss it. I don’t think the MS systems have functions for EVAP systems but I’m not 100% sure


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ryno22980]

Sounds like you have the right idea. Get to know the system before you go crazy with your build. As far as the canister goes as long as your state inspection doesn’t require it then I’d just toss it. I don’t think the MS systems have functions for EVAP systems but I’m not 100% sure


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks, how are you venting your gas tank? And are you getting fuel odor?

 

[JFraser27]

I just have a breather/vent on the vent line and no I do not smell raw fuel at all under he hood or in my garage


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ryno22980]

I just have a breather/vent on the vent line and no I do not smell raw fuel at all under he hood or in my garage


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sounds good, from what I have seen, some get the smell some don't. I think I will cut the vent hose near the tank, add a breather/filter and zip tie it up in the fender. Then I'll leave the rest of the stuff in place until I determine if I have an odor problem or not. If not, I'll delete the rest of the EVAP stuff permanently.

 

[Blown88GT]

...
A. I am considering getting Microsquirt next year to start to learn to tune with my near stock setup. I'd want to gain a decent level of familiarity tuning with TS before either adding a turbo or a H/C/I to my car a year later.

B. I'm in research mode and have a couple of questions:

1. What do you MS guys do with your EVAP/charcoal canister system? I wouldn't mind deleting it all as I don't need any emissions crap on the car. However, I don't want my garage to smell like gas all the time so just venting it to atmosphere doesn't sound appealing.

2. I'm leaning toward Microsquirt while turboing the stock long block. I have a 255 lph fuel pump and stock injectors (34lb) off a friend's 2011 Coyote mustang that I would like to use. I am running a junkyard 70mm MAF off a 94 GT so the cost savings of going MS and not needing to buy a new blow through MAF would be nice. I also think learning to use TunerStudio looks much less confusing/intimidating than using Binary Editor with QH. I already have a WB and feel that I am patient and studious enough about learning to tune. How does this plan sound?

A. The umbrella name is Megasquirt. Microsquirt is a subset. Microsquirt has 2 types; dedicated sealed module & microsquirt module which is what's in the MSPNPG2. Both are MS2.
There is Megasquirt 2 (MS2) & Megasquirt 3 (MS3). MS2 firmware is fully developed; MS3 is more advanced & still being updated.

B. Research Mode is good. Keep it going, it will never end. After 5 years, I'm still learning new things.

1. Leave it alone, do nothing. All my emissions stuff is intact, it's no longer in control by the ECU.

2. MAF is not a requirement for Megasquirt. They are all Speed Density & come with an onboard MAP sensor. I am one of the few that use a MAF & MAP in combination but the converts are growing because it seems to work better for boosted applications. You can use any MAF in a blow-thru; the mass of the air does not change from inlet to throttle body. You will need the calibration curves for both the injectors & the MAF. You can download Tuner Studio Lite which is free, to become familiar with it. There are 2 paid versions, MS & HD. It is called the User Interface (UI). There is no comparison between it & BE/QH. The UI is what sold me on Megasquirt.

 

[JFraser27]

Sounds good, from what I have seen, some get the smell some don't. I think I will cut the vent hose near the tank, add a breather/filter and zip tie it up in the fender. Then I'll leave the rest of the stuff in place until I determine if I have an odor problem or not. If not, I'll delete the rest of the EVAP stuff permanently.

I cut the line under the hood, put a vent on there Incase I ever wanted to put it back on


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ryno22980]

A. The umbrella name is Megasquirt. Microsquirt is a subset. Microsquirt has 2 types; dedicated sealed module & microsquirt module which is what's in the MSPNPG2. Both are MS2.
There is Megasquirt 2 (MS2) & Megasquirt 3 (MS3). MS2 firmware is fully developed; MS3 is more advanced & still being updated.

B. Research Mode is good. Keep it going, it will never end. After 5 years, I'm still learning new things.

1. Leave it alone, do nothing. All my emissions stuff is intact, it's no longer in control by the ECU.

2. MAF is not a requirement for Megasquirt. They are all Speed Density & come with an onboard MAP sensor. I am one of the few that use a MAF & MAP in combination but the converts are growing because it seems to work better for boosted applications. You can use any MAF in a blow-thru; the mass of the air does not change from inlet to throttle body. You will need the calibration curves for both the injectors & the MAF. You can download Tuner Studio Lite which is free, to become familiar with it. There are 2 paid versions, MS & HD. It is called the User Interface (UI). There is no comparison between it & BE/QH. The UI is what sold me on Megasquirt.

Thanks for your response. I've read a lot of your posts already during my searching and it has been very helpful to understand what I am getting into. Obviously, Microsquirt is attactive because of the price, being able to use Tuner Studio, and it looks like it would do everything I would want. Also not having to drop the cash on a new MAF defrays more of the cost. I still have the factory original BAP and O2 sensors on the car, so being able to just pull those off without replacing them equals even more savings.

I already downloaded Tuner Studio Lite and will get a paid version if and when I get the hardware.

My follow up question would be how are you bleeding fuel tank pressure out without the ecu telling the purge valve to open. I just had to pull my gas tank again because it leaked gas all over my garage while being parked overnight. The fuel came out of the level sender seal and I believe excessive pressure pushed the seal out while the car sat overnight.

 

[Mustang5L5]

1. What do you MS guys do with your EVAP/charcoal canister system? I wouldn't mind deleting it all as I don't need any emissions crap on the car. However, I don't want my garage to smell like gas all the time so just venting it to atmosphere doesn't sound appealing.

2. I'm leaning toward Microsquirt while turboing the stock long block. I have a 255 lph fuel pump and stock injectors (34lb) off a friend's 2011 Coyote mustang that I would like to use. I am running a junkyard 70mm MAF off a 94 GT so the cost savings of going MS and not needing to buy a new blow through MAF would be nice. I also think learning to use TunerStudio looks much less confusing/intimidating than using Binary Editor with QH. I already have a WB and feel that I am patient and studious enough about learning to tune. How does this plan sound?

I'm building/built an MS3x setup for my car. Unit is complete and works on the bench, but in the process of starting to wire it into the car. Took me about 6 hours to build it fully and customize it a bit for my needs.


I went with the 3x because of the flexibility and number of i/o available. I run cats on my car mostly due to keeping the sound down, and the stench (the fumes from catless tend to bother me). Since it's only a 2-cat system, i'm eliminating the TAD and just running the TAB. On the Ms3x i have a bunch of spare outputs that can trigger a relay, so i'm simply wiring in the TAB to direct the bypass flow when my RPM or TPS sensor exceed a certain point. With the TAD removed (because no longer need to direct to the heads during warmpup) i simply pump air to the main cats and dump it at WOT. Eventually i'll wire in the charcoal canister as well. There was a good explaination on how to do it on the FB DIYAUtotune/Megasquirt forum, but i can't seem to find it at the moment.


I'm also wiring the car for MAF. I'm using one of the cheap, readily available 99-04 GT 80mm MAFS with the integrated IAT to get it off the manifold. The transfer curves are available, really the hardest part is mounting the thing in the intake tube. I'm currently running the SN95 70mm unit with A9L, and it works great, but i wanted to go a bit bigger.

Right now i'm still bench testing and learning TS. I've set mine up to do fan control, shift light, and integrating the VSS and a front ABS wheel speed sensor to give front/rear speed readings and allow me to use traction control.

I went with a DIY kit, which is a little more of a learning curve than some of the pnp, off-the-shelf versions out there.

 

[Blown88GT]

...My follow up question would be how are you bleeding fuel tank pressure out without the ecu telling the purge valve to open.....

I'm not & am unaware of anyone doing it. The tank is vented, if it weren't you'd never be able to fill it.
I don't know what is causing your problem.

The DIY kit is "end of life" & is no longer available.

You have to ask yourself, are you using the factory harness & factory 60-pin connector?
If so, the Microsquirt is not for you because you will have to cut off the Ford 60-pin connector or splice into the harness & let the connector hang.

 

[Ryno22980]

I'm not & am unaware of anyone doing it. The tank is vented, if it weren't you'd never be able to fill it.
I don't know what is causing your problem.

The DIY kit is "end of life" & is no longer available.

You have to ask yourself, are you using the factory harness & factory 60-pin connector?
If so, the Microsquirt is not for you because you will have to cut off the Ford 60-pin connector or splice into the harness & let the connector hang.

https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/microsquirt-for-1986-93-ford-5-0-mustang/

That is the one I was looking at. Thought you just plug it into the factory harness, install the included MAP sensor, hook it up to your wideband, and check calibrations.

As far as my tank leak situation, I guess I may just have a bad cap that is holding too much pressure. I have been trying to understand how the whole system works so I can make sure I am not missing the problem. I topped off my fuel tank, drove my car the 1 mile home and parked it in the garage at about 4pm. I worked outside going in and out of the garage for hours. I had no sign of leaks or smell as late as 10pm when I let my dog out. The next morning, the whole garage stunk and I had fuel dripping from the top of the tank.

I can't think of anything that could have caused this other than too much pressure or vacuum building up in the tank with ambient temp changes and the seal giving way. I would really rather just delete the whole EVAP system as it's just more wires and hoses to have to protect from a turbo in the future. However, the car stays in my enclosed garage 95% of the time and I don't want to smell gas everytime I go out there.

I'm thinking of running a vacuum line from the fuel tank vent valve to the highest point under the bumper with a carbon filter on the end and seeing if I can get away with that setup.

 

[Mustang5L5]

https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/microsquirt-for-1986-93-ford-5-0-mustang/

That is the one I was looking at. Thought you just plug it into the factory harness, install the included MAP sensor, hook it up to your wideband, and check calibrations.

That setup is plug and play, but it's fairly no-frills. It will run a 5.0 engine fine, but won't have any of the extra features. I think there's only one spare input and it's batch fire. Not anything wrong with that, but it won't be able to run extra circuits like the emissions controls, or do things like sequential injection.


Just run a vented gas cap...if you can find one that's compatible with the fox tank

 

[Ryno22980]

That setup is plug and play, but it's fairly no-frills. It will run a 5.0 engine fine, but won't have any of the extra features. I think there's only one spare input and it's batch fire. Not anything wrong with that, but it won't be able to run extra circuits like the emissions controls, or do things like sequential injection.


Just run a vented gas cap...if you can find one that's compatible with the fox tank

Yeah, that's fine for me. I just have a cruiser and I just want to be able to have the ability to adapt my tune for future changes like different boost levels or better flowing heads without having to drop cash at a pro tuner each time.

The other frills that the more expensive versions have don't interest me. The only thing I might use would be the electric fan control if my DC control ever dies. I believe this version has that option.

I tested my gas cap and it intermittently was not relieving pressure so I have a new one coming. I still think I am going to try to route the vent hose from the tank to behind the gas fill compartment door and see if it smells. If not, I'll delete the whole EVAP system to gain space and to have one less thing to protect from heat if I get the turbo.

 

[Mustang5L5]

I tested my gas cap and it intermittently was not relieving pressure so I have a new one coming. I still think I am going to try to route the vent hose from the tank to behind the gas fill compartment door and see if it smells. If not, I'll delete the whole EVAP system to gain space and to have one less thing to protect from heat if I get the turbo.

If you crouch under the car under the pass side and look near the filler neck, you can usually see the vac line coming off the evap valve and connecting to the hardline going all the way up to the front of the car.

You can simply cut the here, plug the line going to the front, and install a hose connector and install another hose and route it somewhere away from the hot exhaust and put a small filter on the end. I've seen guys drill a small hole in the gas fill neck catch basin, install a bunkhead connect and vent the line into that area. No different than if you had a vented gas cap there.

That's probably the route I will end up taking, although i do have one spare output circuit that I can try to use to program the EVAP logic...if i really wanted.

 

[Blown88GT]

https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/microsquirt-for-1986-93-ford-5-0-mustang/
That is the one I was looking at. Thought you just plug it into the factory harness, install the included MAP sensor, hook it up to your wideband, and check calibrations...

That will work but will not allow use of a MAF.
Also, will not allow A/C WOT cutoff to function.

 

[Ryno22980]

I tested my gas cap and it intermittently was not relieving pressure so I have a new one coming. I still think I am going to try to route the vent hose from the tank to behind the gas fill compartment door and see if it smells. If not, I'll delete the whole EVAP system to gain space and to have one less thing to protect from heat if I get the turbo.

If you crouch under the car under the pass side and look near the filler neck, you can usually see the vac line coming off the evap valve and connecting to the hardline going all the way up to the front of the car.

You can simply cut the here, plug the line going to the front, and install a hose connector and install another hose and route it somewhere away from the hot exhaust and put a small filter on the end. I've seen guys drill a small hole in the gas fill neck catch basin, install a bunkhead connect and vent the line into that area. No different than if you had a vented gas cap there.

That's probably the route I will end up taking, although i do have one spare output circuit that I can try to use to program the EVAP logic...if i really wanted.

Yup, this is exactly what I have done. Once I get the tank reinstalled and some gas in it. I'll test it out as far as odor.

 

[Ryno22980]

https://www.efisource.com/wp/shop/microsquirt-for-1986-93-ford-5-0-mustang/
That is the one I was looking at. Thought you just plug it into the factory harness, install the included MAP sensor, hook it up to your wideband, and check calibrations...

That will work but will not allow use of a MAF.
Also, will not allow A/C WOT cutoff to function.

Good to know, thanks. I think I'd still be fine with that. I know adding the MAF like you did, can make it easier to tune, but I think I'll still be happy with this setup for the price.

 

[5.0thunder]

If you're not purchasing immediately, I may be willing to sell you a PNP MS2 V3.57 system. It's the assembled ECU from DIYAutotune with their 8' harness and I'll install a female ECU connector to plug up to your factory harness. I can install the connector at any length so if you want the harness only 1ft long, I could do that, or leave some room in the harness for future use as well.

Essentially this, but with the harness however long you want.

 

[DemonGT]

Dose the Microsquirt require a wideband installed? If so, iv heard people have removed a single O2 sensor and replaced it with the wideband sensor? Dose this work and if so
how dose the ECU not become mad with only one O2?

Having some part throttle issues with my N/A 410 and was looking at the MS's and other ECU tuners to possibly try to fix the issues.

 

[Laminar]

If you install a Megasquirt, you generally remove the factory ECU completely - it can no longer get mad about O2 sensors if it's not wired up.

The Megasquirt does not require that you use any wideband sensor, it can accept anywhere from 0 sensors to one per cylinder depending on how much info you want. But I can't imagine the nightmare of trying to tune a car without a wideband - you have no idea where it's running and you're either leaving tons of power/efficiency on the table, or you're running way closer to dangerous conditions than you know.