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Discussion Starter #1
For a supercharged 5.0, who makes the best ignition with timing retard. I have looked at the Crane HI6R-TRC and the MSD 6BTM. I don't know anything about them except what I see in ads. I see Crane promotes their digital technology over the MSD's analog and claims 3 times the spark energy. I like the msd's numbered retard dial with the 1,2, or 3 vs the crane just goes from 0 to 20 degrees, whether that matters or not. What are you guys using with good luck. I want something good and reliable also. Thanks for any advise.
 

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I have the MSD on mine. I like it and think its a good piece. I believe it will have more than enough energy to light the fires. I am not sure, about the crane, but with the adjustable timing of the MSD, you can actually calabrate it.
 

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I used the Crane Hi-6 TRC for a long time (PMS now controls boost retard). Had no problems and really liked the Crane Hi-6 TRC. Plus it can be used on a N/A car for total timing advance/retard or nitrous cars. Only back drawn when compared to the MSD 6BTM, you have to buy a 2 bar map sensor for the Crane.

Troy
 

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Take a look at this item: http://www.jandssafeguard.com/safeguard.html IMO it is the best unit available for prevention of detonation. It also is a boost retard and rev limiter. It can be used in conjunction with an MSD 6A or 6AL.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I installed the pro-M PIH kit on my 94 cobra. When I talked to the tech guy at pro-M, he said with the PIH kit & A9L computer I needed a aftermarket ignition like msd or crane. He said that the crane seemed to work a little better. I don't know if it's because of the crane having more spark energy or just his opinion. For some reason with the PIH on 94-95 cars they need more spark energy. Guys with the PIH and stock ignition say it starts cutting out at around 4000 rpm's. That is one reason I was leaning towards the crane if it actually has more spark energy than the msd! Thanks for the replies.
 

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Can the crane be adjusted like the MSD ? How does it control the timing retard ?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The crane has a dial that you mount inside the car just like the msd. The difference is the msd has the numbers 1,2,or 3 on it where the crane just goes from 0 to 20. They both take the timing out as boost goes higher. On the msd , you run a vac. hose to the ignition box and with the crane you run a vac hose to a crane BAP sensor. The msd can remove a max. of 15 degrees timing and the crane a total of 20 degrees. One thing that's kinda neat is there is a red light beside the knob. The red light comes on whenever the unit is pulling timing out. I assume it's so under boost, if you see the red light , you know the timing retard is doing it's job. Hopefully thats right. Thanks
 

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aaron gardner said:
For a supercharged 5.0, who makes the best ignition with timing retard. I have looked at the Crane HI6R-TRC and the MSD 6BTM. I don't know anything about them except what I see in ads. I see Crane promotes their digital technology over the MSD's analog and claims 3 times the spark energy. I like the msd's numbered retard dial with the 1,2, or 3 vs the crane just goes from 0 to 20 degrees, whether that matters or not. What are you guys using with good luck. I want something good and reliable also. Thanks for any advise.
My opinion, the Crane is much better. Reasons being, the Crane is digital opposed to the MSD which is analog. That's enough of a selling point for me. MSD doesn't get digital until there Digital series. I have been using the Crane for a few years now and it's great!
 

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I run a MSD-btm and I like it.....

In so far as Digital vs. Analog....the digital would be more programable if it were possible(its not in this case), the units are fairly simple, taking out timing in relation to boost.

I work in a world of small electronics, some digital and some analog. The digital can be more precise, but the analog almost always prove to be more durable.

FWIW......
 

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Shifter said:
I run a MSD-btm and I like it.....

In so far as Digital vs. Analog....the digital would be more programable if it were possible(its not in this case), the units are fairly simple, taking out timing in relation to boost.

I work in a world of small electronics, some digital and some analog. The digital can be more precise, but the analog almost always prove to be more durable.

FWIW......
I agree with you in some aspects, but I have seen way too many posts about MSD's going out on people. Never seen anyone post about there Crane dying on them.:)
 

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I agree with you in some aspects, but I have seen way too many posts about MSD's going out on people. Never seen anyone post about there Crane dying on them.
Agreed, and I thought about this long and hard before buying the msd......

I figured it was simple probability. The same simplicity that makes almost all auto races won by a man.....= almost all competitors are men!

There is probably like 200 MSD's in vehicles for every 1 Crane. So of course you are going to hear more MSD's failing.....I figured that there is a reason that there are 200 MSD's sold for every 1 crane(these are purely hypothetical numbers here).....so I bought the MSD.

the above thoughts are purely the authors $.02, and are totally ficticious, take it for what its worth and no more...its just my opinion.....
 

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much price difference ? I know with the MSD, the numbers kinda give you an estimate of how much you are pulling out. Has anyone ever "calabrated " the BTM before ? I have on my last engine and it worked great. If anyone wants to know how to do this, let me know and I will explain it .
 

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This is a way to remove an exact amount of timing at a given amount of boost :

How to calibrate your BTM

Things needed: timing light, regulated compressed air source or squeeze bulb with gauge, MAXIMUM boost produced by engine.

1) Remove timing spout connector and start the car
2) Set base timing to 20 degrees (this keeps the engine from dieing while timing is being pulled out and it’s easy to subtract from)
3) Using the compressed air source; apply your MAX boost pressure into the BTM
4) Use the timing light together with the BTM knob to remove your desired amount of timing.
5) Reset base timing to previous setting

EXAMPLE:

With a base timing of 14 degrees (EEC is 16 degrees) your total advance under WOT is 30 degrees. Say you want to run 22 degrees total timing at maximum boost. The difference is 8 degrees that you need to remove. You have 12lbs of boost at max rpm. Now, you apply 12psi into the BTM while the base timing is at 20 degrees. While using the timing light, turn the BTM knob until the timing marks are at 12 degrees. You are done with the BTM knob now. Return the base timing to 14 degrees. Now you have calibrated the BTM to remove 8 degrees exactly at 12lbs of boost regardless of where the base timing is.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Sounds like a good idea.
 

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When I ran my old S trim car, this is how I did it. I used base timing only, set it high and then used the BTM to pull it back. I started out running 24 degrees initial (spout always out) and 20 total. Then I went to 28 initial and 24 total, and picked up 4 tenths ! Went from 10.80's to 10.40's ! The spout out menthod did work on my car. All I did was keep recalabrating the BTM and switching things to find out what works best. Eventually, I ended up with a 10.13
 

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I get it, but.....

How/what do you use to regulate the compressed air so low???

I have a real nice air compressor, but the gauge don't read below 20 psi???
 

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Either change the gauge on the main regulator or what I did was add a second regulator that was finner than the main. I have it like another air tool attachment. At the end of this I added a small barbed fitting so I could get a vac line on.
 

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Clever! I'll be looking for pieces to do exactly that.....You've been a big help, I've been trying to figure out how to do this just to make sure the btm works and is accurate.;)
 
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