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Discussion Starter #1
Well started tearing stuff down some more and the cylinder that had Zero compression also the valve spring was broke :mad: I was hoping nothing was wrong with the valvetrain but i guess not. I dont know what im going to do now. Kind of in a bind. I may possibly just sell the heads and stuff, but i dont know yet. Here are some pics.





 

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aw man, what a shame. Sorry to hear that juiced. Do you have an extra car to drive while the stang is down? I hope you get everything fixed.

Try talking to TJ on stangnet, I believe he has broken plenty and maybe can help you out.
 

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what cams did you have? were they PI cam based cores?


After reading about this, i officially bow out of the cams game. I may look into the billets after a few people have been running them for a solid 6 months or so, but this is getting ridiculous.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Rancid, i kind of have a car to use while the stang is down, Depending how long it is down for though.

Matt they were PI cams reground to 540/222 112. Modmax valves and springs.

I am thinking about selling the heads,cams, intake, the works so i can start saving some $$. Possibly buy a Cobra motor or something. So whoever wants a set of one of the best flowing ported PI heads PM me ;)
 

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sorry to here about your luck dave. hope everthing goes well with what is next!

Keep in touch mine heads are next to go on...


Eric:eek:
 

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Sorry to see that Dave. Where's the valve? Did it stay in sight or did it take the plunge to the great unknown (i.e. in the cylinder)? Ahhh...just remembered that you have the SS valves, so your bottom end is probably OK, as well as the head (hopefully). If the head and shortblock are OK, you could always get a set of PI cams, remove the shims, and be on your merry way. Good luck with whatever your decision is.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
PhatDoggy said:
Sorry to see that Dave. Where's the valve? Did it stay in sight or did it take the plunge to the great unknown (i.e. in the cylinder)? Ahhh...just remembered that you have the SS valves, so your bottom end is probably OK, as well as the head (hopefully). If the head and shortblock are OK, you could always get a set of PI cams, remove the shims, and be on your merry way. Good luck with whatever your decision is.
Well keith unfortunetely the bottom end is shot to. I did a compression test and that cylinder had Zero compression. The valve is still there. I am crossing my fingers there was no valve/head damage. if there is then i will be taking on a bigger loss. Either way it looks the heads are getting sold. So my loss will be someone elses gain. I will let everyone know what the other side looks like as soon as i tear it down some more. I was going to do it tonight but i am just so aggravated with the whole situation. I didnt think a spring broke but i was wrong. Thanks for the support guys.

Dave
 

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i feel your pain. over the summer i broke a spring, dropped the valve, shattered the piston, and destroyed the block. it wasn't pretty. good luck with whatever you do. i'm planning on going with hp n/a cams, as i have not heard of any probs from those.
 

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what the hell is going on here:confused: modmax springs are supposed to be better than the stockers. I may have to go and buy me some stock pi springs:( all i can say is dont get regrinds.
shims and lash caps are like bandages, they dont stop the bleeding they slow it down.

john
 

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I have regrinds and have seen 8000rpm alot.I think its more of the lift then anything.I run the HP cams and have had zero problems.
JMHO,but all the broken valve springs I ve seen have come from high lift cams.
TJM broke several sets of springs with crane & modmax cams.He has SHM's now and has had great luck so far.

Carlos broke a valve spring with either modmax or cranes.He has the HP cams now and hasn't had any problems.Regrinds aren't the problem,the specs are the problem.

Tim
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Well i honestly dont think it was the spring that failed. I just spoke with TroyV on this subject and he had some good points about this whole regrind thing. Its the shimming of the adjusters that is the problem. The adjusters arent all pumping up with oil the same. So since all of the adjusters have the same size shim, but if they dont pump up the rocker/roller or whatever you want to call it is actually loose. I think because that was loose it wiggled its way out and the spring let go because it got caught up in or hit it. I dont think the regrind or the spring is to blame. Troy will hopefully chime in and he knows alittle more on this subject than i do, and he had some great points.

Dave
 

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Discussion Starter #13
cobra killer said:
I have regrinds and have seen 8000rpm alot.I think its more of the lift then anything.I run the HP cams,and my porter said if I wanted any more lift he would have to do some serious work on the seats.
JMHO,but all the broken valve springs I ve seen have come from high lift cams.
TJM broke several sets of springs with crane & modmax cams.He has SHM's now and has had great luck so far.

Carlos broke a valve spring with either modmax or cranes.He has the HP cams now and hasn't had any problems.Regrinds aren't the problem,the specs are the problem.

Tim
Well i think there is alot of possibilites why people are breaking the springs. Cobra Killer- what are the specs of your cams and how much have you driven the car? my car was a daily driver. Had 7000 miles on the springs and alot of abuse and high RPMS before it let go. Others only lasted maybe 2k miles. Some even broke at startup. I do not think the lift is to high, something else is happening, i think, for these things to break.

Dave
 

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I guess I should have been more specific in my description. The point I was trying to make is the problem does not seem to be the spring but the spec on certain cams thus my asking if anyone had a failure on a stock cams.

The next question is what cams were being used when the springs failed?

Steve
 

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Dave, thanks for closing the loop with me tonight.

Crap. I hope this shim thing works. I'm going to shim until there is no valve train noise whatsoever.


I have been thinking about it and I'm not sure this step can be avoided if you are going to run a regrind cam at all. I think you need to install the heads and see which lifters pump to the appropriate dimension.....and which don't. Then shim the stragglers (or possibly shim them all to preload all the adjusters equally), retorque the cam caps and away you go?......I hope so.

I don't see any reason why preloading the adjusters equally will hurt....especially where by definition they should recede back if shimmed a few thousandths over the gap originally left behind.
 

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my thoughts...

...someone needs to check and see if the valve lenth is the same as stock, some valve co. make there valves .100 longer, also people need to measure the distance from the seat(in head) to installed tip height. I have seen some heads that had valve jobs done on them and have the seats/angles cut so deep into the valve seat, that moves the valve deeper in the head and changes the valve train geomtery. I've run Crane re-grinds (wth "lash caps" & "No shims") for 2 years now wth "stock" springs, retaines & locs (& 7000 rpm burnouts) and have even deg my cams in +x & -x and no problems. also look at the valve guides, maybe there not tight to the head and have moved. ther is something else wrong here, its not in the cams!
Randy Stinchcomb
"Oakland Raiders Rock"
 

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Dave. Clean the broken spring. Inspect the spring material in the areas right around the break and tell me if there is any change in color or texture as opposed to the rest of the spring. The only ways the spring would break is if it took a direct hit by way of the cam pushing the loose and wiggling rocker/follower right into the spring in an uneven way........or because the spring itself got brittle at one point and snapped. Hydrogen Embrittlement is very common with springs like this and if they see any sort of uneven force they can age very quickly and break.

One thing will tell if this is the case. My car is running very well at present. It will stay parked and I'm going to shim as planned. If it quiets down, I'll go to Dean's as planned......Then I'll beat the f r i g g i n s h i t out of it and see where we are.

I know you're frustrated Dave, but let me do this and see what happens. I'll give you all the specs on the shims and exactly what I did. My gut tells me that this is the solution to the problem.
 

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Someone needs to get to the bottom of this valve spring issue! What a mess.:barf:
 

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Sorry to hear about your luck, Dave. :( Let us know what happens with everything.
 

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Well Dave I am truely sorry braking stuff sux a$$.

Now I am with Randy on this I say some of it may haveto do with the valve length, I mean most that have broke springs have had either valve jobs or the oversized valves which need to be cut to length. I run the mod max springs w/ stock cams for about 3000 miles and lots of 7000rpm burnouts and they see lots of 6300 plus rpms and no problems at all I am also running stock valves with no valve job. I guess only time will tell. I will e going with a set of Comps billet cams as soon as they come in knock on wood and hope for no problems.
 
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