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What would I gain/loose w/205cc AFR's?

  • +30rwhp/+15rwtq

    Votes: 6 40.0%
  • +15rwhp

    Votes: 6 40.0%
  • +0rwhp/-rwtq

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • -15rwhp/-rwtq

    Votes: 1 6.7%
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've got a local buyer for my 185cc AFR's and ped mt RR's if I'm interested in selling. Head of choice would be 205cc AFR milled .018" for bump from 10.25 to ~ 10.7 to 1 compression. Ported RPM intake, 232/240 @ .050" dur .566"/.557" 111LC cam, BBK 13/4 LT's, 2.5" x-pipe - would stay for the time being. Could always upgrade to 3" exh/Vic 5.0 or ported Holley later. But is the head swap worth anything?

I'm making 365rwhp/375rwtq in my current form. What would I make after the head upgrade to 205cc AFR's and slight bump in compression? Vote.
 

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I dont know a lot about this but I think Eds input would mean the most since he did the cam. I dont know how to guess this stuff anymore after seeing all the different results people get from the things they do to their motors. I hope you get the 400 your looking for, good luck.

My 302 goes on the dyno Monday. I hope I dont get upset about it. :eek:
 

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Want my opinion? I think you would gain 10-15 rwhp, but I think that the gains you are looking for could be found in cheaper and simpler areas. Example, your exhaust (and mine) is not as free flowing as a high HP/ N/A engine would like. Maybe 3"? How about running more compression? (don't you have 93-94 octane in Fl?) This is fairly inexpensive.
Maybe yet another intake swap/test. Just kidding! Maybe wait and see how this Holley works out with my 331 and go from there? Ideas? Btw, did you have any work done to the Holley lower when you tried it?

Andy
 

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Can you post whatever flow figures and dimensions you have on these things? 2.02 and 2.08 intake valves right? Stock hieght intake port on both right? The exhaust is raised some on the 205's isn't it? What's the exh valve on the 205's? Any flow figures or port dimensions on the intake?
 

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Just looked @ AFR website on the 205's. They seem to have the 185's by 15cfm as low as .200" and climb to 30cfm by .500".

Exhaust side is just as good.

Should be interesting, since cyll head is no excuse - this one can support over 600HP N/A.

I would talk to Ed and get his opinion.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
AFR 205cc uses 2.08/1.60 valve setup. Intake port is, of course, 205cc's while the exhaust is 70cc's. Intake port is stock location and exhaust is slightly raised by .125". Intake port dimension mirrors a Fel Pro 1262.

185cc AFR uses 2.02/1.60 valve setup. Intake port is, of course, 185cc's while the exhaust is 69cc's. Intake port is stock location as is the exhaust. Intake port dimension mirrors a Fel Pro 1250.

205cc AFR flows ~ +15cfm @ .200" over the 185cc and that grows in a pretty linear fashion to 30cfm @ .500" lift on the intake side. Similar gains on the exhaust side though not quite as large.

I know when I upgraded from my ported Performer heads which were ~ 175cc's to the 185cc AFR's that I gained 17rwhp/10rwtq peak to peak and 28rwhp @ 6000rpms. Didn't lose hp or tq at any point in the rpm range. Of course that doesn't guarantee I'd see similar results in this case.

I was also thinking how I've seen a couple of good running 306ci NA setups with 200cc Dart Sr's which also had portwork. Plus all the TEA TFS TW setups running similar cross section heads. So I really don't think 205cc inline head is too large for a 331ci stroker IMHO.

Still not sure if I'll do it now though. Timing doesn't quite feel right. Probably better served to watch how LX4PLAY's, BIGMIKE's, and others combos turn out.
 

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Like I said before, you can be my guinepig....(Did I spell that right)? I think 10-20 would be reasonable. Are going to stay with the new cam? How do you plan to pass smog in florida? or do you have a stock motor for smog? Good Luck:D
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
No smog in FL - LOL! Well no smog TESTING anyways. :D
I'd keep the current cam. Per Ed it should do the trick into the 400-420rwhp range with AFR 205cc/ported Holley/bigger exhaust.

It looks like I'm gonna hold off on this head swap til winter now. I'll probably have alot more available info from what others have tried in the meantime. Tired of 10rwhp or 15rwhp mods. If I do this its gonna be 420rwhp or bust - hydro roller. :evil:
 

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Streetpower,
Must be nice....;) Boy if I didn't have smog here I would have 420 RWH too. :D Good luck with it....Maybe you should consider a 408 stroker with a hyrdo-roller like me....:D It would be real easy then to make those numbers and probably a hell of alot more streetable too. Although I am sure your car is fine on the street now. Imagine that a 408 with 150 shot.... are your wheels turning yet.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Trust me a stroked 351ci is always in my line of thinking. Especially if I'm going to be buying new heads, intake, longtubes, cam, etc,etc. Thats something else I'll have to weigh out before I make my move. Balancing budget, power needs/wants, and ease of install.
 

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In this case bigger is better....:evil: "Wants and needs" whats that.:D You could always sell the whole package and start over....
:lol:
 

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Street....I think you knew the answer to your question before you posted......:D

I am lookng at my used Victor 5.0 intake....it came with a 3/8 or 1/2 spacer that I have to use because of the bolts......

How will this affect my power and RPM range? If it is going to decrease my ultimate HP, then I want it off!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
NTIMID8-

Selling the whole engine package and starting over is something I'll seriously consider. I'd love to have a 11 to 1 383ci Windsor/AFR 225cc/Vic 5.8/Solid Roller/1 7/8 Kooks LT/3" exh/Pro-M 92mm MAF/4" powerpipe/90mm TB/42lb inj/etc setup. I'd keep the 5spd and hopefully it would throw down 520rwhp+. Even at my 3500lb race weight I'd think the car would do high 10's @ 128mph or so on motor. And I'd keep the 100hp shot of NOS for good measure ;)

I've been out of the car scene for awhile before and I realize that I can never get away from it. Now its just a matter of spending my money wisely so that I get the most enjoyment from this hobby. And I need to think some more about what exactly I want in a car.

BIGMIKE-

Running a 3/8" or even 1/2" spacer on the Vic 5.0 isn't going to hurt your power IMHO. It actually might flatten/widen your tq curve without affecting peak hp much if at all. Good thing is you've got both spacers and the ability to run no spacer so you can test this stuff on the dyno. Hood clearance might actually be the bigger issue for you. BTW - Did Anderson give you any ideas of the cam specs you'll be running? Its a hydro roller right? Definitely let us know.
 

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STREETPOWER EFI 331 said:
It looks like I'm gonna hold off on this head swap til winter now

LOL. Yeah, right... ;)

I give you till two days after BigMike posts his results before you change something major... <again>...



:evil:
 

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Streetpower,

I just looked at an old dyno pull you made on 3/12/2000 and you were making 323 rwhp, and you were happy with that, your 218/226 cam, and those ported Ebrocks. Then BigDaddyLTDLX, myself and others corrupted you here at the Corral. What have we done :(

Interestingly enough, you have added approximately 21 hp/yr, so in two more years of wrenching and throwing money at that 331, you should be making ... 411 rwhp! Cool.

P.S. Gosh, I have known you on the Corral for quite a while. Remember that first KC block. Man, I never thought they would pony up another one for you. Time sure flies. Alex is now 20 months old and can count to 10! How is your son doing? Hey, at least you have added some power to your car in those two years. Two years later, I'm still making about the same power as this block gets older, despite a cam swap. I think my lifters are getting shot too, because my power falls off a cliff at 5950 rpm. It should gradually fall off to 6250 rpm. Of course, I've got no money to fix the problem. I guess I'll just keep her rolling until my ship comes in someday. Of course, by then, I'll just recreate whatever you have optimized :) Talk to you later.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
SMM-

3/2000 is shortly after I got the 331ci put together. This car was stone stock in 6/1999 and I was just gonna bolt-on some GT-40's/Edelbrock intake and go. LOL! That sure didn't last. Within a few months I ordered the KC 331ci, Edelbrock Performers ported, Saleen/Vortech intake ported, CompCam XE270HR, 1 5/8 BBK LT's, 24lbers, 75mm MAF, 70mm TB, etc,etc. So yeah I was thrilled to make 323rwhp/355rwtq cause I was only "supposed" to have a 270-280rwhp GT-40 combo on the stock shortblock - LOL! Its an illness and I realize that. Same thing happened with my 92' coupe back in 94'. Went from stock to mid 11's @ 127mph with a 306ci/Edelbrock/S-trim combo on street tires. Then in 96' I went cold turkey and sold the coupe. In 98' I got married, bought my house, and we had Austin my oldest son (now 3.5yrs old). Shortly after settling back into a comfortable routine it was Mustang Madness on the brain once again. Can't stay away from this stuff. So in 99' I bought the vert and the rest is history. It is pretty funny though how time flies. Very nice to have a forum like this to exchange ideas with people worldwide who have similar setups. Invaluable really - even though I rarely follow a previously chartered course. :D

Wow - 20mos old and he counts to 10! Geez my youngest son Grant is 17mos old and only has about a 10 word vocabulary - LOL! You know - stroker/cam/heads/wheels/exhaust/power/mustang,etc. Oh and dadda/momma. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
BIGMIKE-

I think I've jinxed you enough in the past - LOL! I'm pulling for you though. Still want to know more about this cam you'll be running as well as what compression you'll have. You've got flattop pistons right? And the AFR's - will they be milled or as delivered with 60cc chambers?
 
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