1970 351w vs Later Motors

1239 Views 12 Replies 7 Participants Last post by 417stang, Jul 2, 2008

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Discussion Starter · Jun 18, 2008

Anyone know a good source of info on the differences between the 351 windsors from year to year?

I have a 1970 and I'm putting on an aluminum intake manifold. The bolts I took out of the stock one (there are 16 of them) are longer than the ones in the ARP bolt kit for the 351w (ARP 154-2001). And in the ARP bolt kit there are only 12 bolts! There are 16 holes in the heads and 16 holes in my new intake manifold. So I'm wondering if 1970 was a special case.

I DO NOT want to reuse the old bolts. I tried that and one of them snapped off. It took me 3 hours with the "easy out" left handed drill bits to get the broken bolt out of the head. Any thoughts on where to get the correct bolts?

Sorry if these are remedial questions. This is my first real project. I'll sure appreciate any help you can offer.

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kazcoupe

· #2 · Jun 18, 2008

other than the deck hieght there is noth different about 70'.
69'-70' are 9.480 dh and 71' on up are 9.503.Recount the threaded holes because I have a 351 and a 302 in the garage and they both have 6 bolts per side.what intake is it?

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Discussion Starter · #3 · Jun 18, 2008

It's an offenhauser 360 degree manifold.

But I took the bolts out of the stock manifold and there are 16. Here's a pic of the holes in the head and a pic of the stamp on the block. Definitely 16 holes in the manifold.

farm4.static.flickrDOTCOM/3023/2591263174_bcf758c153.jpg
farm4.static.flickrDOTCOM/3051/2591263000_3113556966.jpg

It won't let me post pics yet because I'm a new user. But you can go to those links and see. You just have to replace the DOTCOM with the actual thing. Thanks!

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gadget73

· #4 · Jun 18, 2008

Maybe go to the hardware store for stainless bolts or grade 8 in the proper size? Actually grade 5 would probably be fine for the job. Won't look quite as pretty but it'll be functional.

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Discussion Starter · #5 · Jun 18, 2008

gadget73 said:
Maybe go to the hardware store for stainless bolts or grade 8 in the proper size? Actually grade 5 would probably be fine for the job. Won't look quite as pretty but it'll be functional.

Thanks! Functional is fine for me. I'm just trying to get it started so that I can move it in and out of the garage more easily. I guess I'll save the pretty stuff for the rebuild.

One more thing... If I use hardware store bolts, should I get washers? The stock bolts didn't have them but they kind of looked like they were built in.

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hickfied

· #6 · Jun 18, 2008

Either get a bolt with a flanged head, or use washers.

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Discussion Starter · #7 · Jun 18, 2008

Thanks, everybody!!!

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Discussion Starter · #8 · Jun 23, 2008

Ok, So I tried to find grade 8 bolts at a few hardware stores in Chicago, and nobody has what I need. The stock bolts are 5/16-18 X 2-1/4. The ARP kit I have (and every other bolt kit sold) uses 2". The only grade 8s I can find are 2" and 2-1/2".

How will I know if 2" is long enough? The stock bolts didn't use washers. The ARP bolts come with washers. Should I use them? That would make the under-head-length even less. What do y'all think?

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Kato Engineering

· #9 · Jun 23, 2008

go to a REAL hardware / bolt / industrial hardware store...

it may entail NOT RIDING the train.....

because the train dont go there....

there are plenty of real , REAL bolt stores....

even in "bum fuking egypt" , they have bolt stores.....

too short of a bolt will ruin the threads in the heads...!

also, put lots of white grease on the threads...!!!!

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Kato Engineering

· #10 · Jun 23, 2008

go to a REAL hardware / bolt / industrial hardware store...

it may entail NOT RIDING the train.....

because the train dont go there....

there are plenty of real , REAL bolt stores....

even in "bum fuking egypt" , they have REAL bolt stores.....

too short of a bolt will ruin the threads in the heads...!

also, put lots of white grease on the threads...!!!!

See less See more

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MurPHy4570

· #11 · Jun 23, 2008

kazcoupe said:
other than the deck hieght there is noth different about 70'.
69'-70' are 9.480 dh and 71' on up are 9.503.Recount the threaded holes because I have a 351 and a 302 in the garage and they both have 6 bolts per side.what intake is it?

Early 351W engines used 16 bolt intake ahd head configurations. This was later deleted in favor of the 302 intake bolt pattern.

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Discussion Starter · #12 · Jul 2, 2008

Thanks everyone.
I went to some "industrial" hardware stores that some people recommended. Still didn't have the 2-1/4 length bolts I needed. But I got tipped off to the GREATEST WEBSITE OF ALL TIME. McMaster-Carr!!!! It won't let me post links yet but...

doubleyou doubleyou doubleyou dot mcmaster dot com

HOLY COW!!! They had exactly what I needed and they even came in flange head like the originals. PLUS the box of 25 grade 8 bolts was only NINE BUCKS!!! That's almost a third the cost of the ARP kits that summit sells and more than twice the number of bolts. Now that I have enough of the proper bolts in the right size, I can't wait to try and get the old thing running again!

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417stang

· #13 · Jul 2, 2008

The reason the package has only 12 intake bolts is all windsors after 1977 had 4 bolts removed from them so they could use the same head as the 302 . All windsors before 1978 had a head with an L shaped water port 16 intake bolts and 1.84 intake valves with 1,54 exhaust . After1977 windsor had the same heads as a 302 , 1.78 intake valves and only 12 intake bolts.

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